# Can the Valar be killed?



## gate7ole (Sep 19, 2002)

I thought that the Valar and Maiar are immortal. But there are some passages when an Ainu is threatened to be killed. (e.g Melkor by Ungoliant). Can it be that by being confined into Ea, they lose also their immortality?


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## Lantarion (Sep 20, 2002)

I think an Ainu can be killed by another Ainu, but not by any of the Children of Ilúvatar, in my understanding. An Ainu's physical form can be destroyed, and therefore it must either take a new shape in Arda or stay outside, by a Kid of Illy.


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## Grond (Sep 20, 2002)

I'll have to find where I saw the answer to this. Somewhere in the HoMe, I'm sure. It speaks of Manwe's wish to destroy/kill Melkor after the Battle of the Valar where Earendil casts Ancalagon from the heavens.

It states in there that the Valar had not the ability to do such a thing. They can vanquish and capture but not destroy. It is clear in the passage I read that only Eru can destroy a Valar.


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## Chymaera (Sep 21, 2002)

Is not Túrin supposed to slay Melkor at the Last Battle?


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## Grond (Sep 21, 2002)

As decreed by Eru, The Final Battle is where Melkor is slain. That is the only place where such a thing can happen.


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## gate7ole (Sep 21, 2002)

I thought so too, that the Valar can't be slain.
So all those "killing" of Maiar or Valar must not be taken literally, and they mean that their spirit is diminished and they lose much of their strength


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