# To Tol Eressëa or to Valinor?



## Helcaraxë (Feb 18, 2004)

When the Elves and the Ring-bearers departed to the West, did they go to Tol Eressëa, or to Valinor? If they went to Valinor, what about the prohibition of the Noldor from going back?


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## Manveru (Feb 18, 2004)

Tol Eressea... for sure (though I'm not sure...)

*flies away to find some quotes...*


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## Lhunithiliel (Feb 18, 2004)

I think the books say to the "Undying Lands"
Well... if we take into consideration that by teh end of the ThA those included Tol Eressea and Aman, then the "air" of immortality and the spirit-healing effect must have been on both these places. Yet, I think the "regular" trans-sea line was between the ME and TE rather than ME-Aman.
So I think that last ship sailed to TE.


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## Minuel Lasgalas (Feb 18, 2004)

Helcaraxë said:


> When the Elves and the Ring-bearers departed to the West, did they go to Tol Eressëa, or to Valinor? If they went to Valinor, what about the prohibition of the Noldor from going back?




Tol Eressëa first. Galadriel had received pardon from the Valar but had rejected it. I think that she could journey on to Valinor considering her 'services rendered' in the war against Sauron and her banning was removed. 

From my memory... the mortals [hobbits] would remain in Tol Eressëa - a paradise and heal from their hurts, a nonpenal purgatory, until they chose to die.

Still looking though


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## Starflower (Feb 18, 2004)

I think Melian here is right, that the Eldar and Gandalf went on to Valinor itself, whereas the hobbits (and later Gimli) would stay in Tol Eressea til it was their time to die. But staying in TOl Eressea was not necessarily worse that Valinor itself, after all the Teleri still lived there and it was smaller and maybe a quieter place one would imagine.


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## Khôr’nagan (Feb 20, 2004)

I had always thought they had gone to Valinor, but then again I had never really considered the matter thoroughly before. I guess it makes more sense for the Hobbits to go to Tol Eressea, though certainly Gandalf (or should I say Olórin?) would go to Valinor at some point, and likely Galadriel would desire to see her home of long ago once again. Elrond I am unsure of, for he was of Mortal descent, and therefore I do not think that he would go to Valinor, nor would any of his house. But I am not sure of myself here, so forgive me if I am in any ways mistaken.


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## Minuel Lasgalas (Feb 20, 2004)

Khôr’nagan said:


> I had always thought they had gone to Valinor, but then again I had never really considered the matter thoroughly before. I guess it makes more sense for the Hobbits to go to Tol Eressea, though certainly Gandalf (or should I say Olórin?) would go to Valinor at some point, and likely Galadriel would desire to see her home of long ago once again. Elrond I am unsure of, for he was of Mortal descent, and therefore I do not think that he would go to Valinor, nor would any of his house. But I am not sure of myself here, so forgive me if I am in any ways mistaken.



Elrond was half-elven, but based on the actions of his parents - Earendil and Elwing [who were also half-elven/maiar] the Valar gave he and his brother the right to choose their race - Elrond chose Elven kind, Elros chose Men and became the first King of Númenor as Tar-Minyatur. 

Elrond's children were given the right to choose - as long as they went with him when he departed [my understanding]... if they stayed, they, in that action stated their choice - though I think that might be debated. Arwen made her choice; the sons, Elrohir and Elladan are not known... other than they remained at Rivendell with Celeborn when he came up from Lorien after the departure of Galadriel.

Elros' children did _not_ get this choice - which became a serious point of contention later. 

So... Elrond would certainly have the right to go to Valinor and would as I think would both Galadriel and Olorin/Gandalf.

[edit] I would look at Tol Eressëa being the first stop on the journey for the Elven/Maiar passengers... next stop being the Undying Lands


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## Khôr’nagan (Feb 21, 2004)

Yes, I suppose that Elrond may have gone on to Valinor as well. I only thought that perhaps as a result of his Mortal descent he would not be allowed to pass its borders, as it is forbidden of Mortal Men to do so. But then again he's Elf-kind and not mortal, so I do suppose that his passage would indeed be permitted.


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## Starflower (Mar 5, 2004)

I would say that Elrond definitely would hav been allowed to enter Aman as he was counted among the elven-kind, as Elros was a Man.. And besides, his 'service' to Middle-earth was very great, not only did he have to leave his brother, but he also gave up his daughter to ensure the line of Kings would survive and M-E would have peace. After all he was also counted among the Wise,and considered probably second in influence only to Galadriel -if at all.
And it must have been especially poignant for Galadriel to return to Aman after so many Ages in exile... remember she had been born in Aman in the time of the Trees. And being of the Noldor, who were not allowed to return, even after they were pardoned, she would not return out of pride and maybe stubborness as well. Imagine returning 'home' after thousands of years.... gosh it must have been the closest thing to 'heaven' for her...


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