# WHAT is Sauron?



## pointy-eared (Feb 12, 2002)

in Appendix A, after the great downfall of Numenor, Sauron comes back to Mordor as 'a spirit of hatred borne upon a dark wind'. That's wonderfully relevent of how evil he is, but powerful and magic beings like elves and istari -Galadriel and Gandalf- cannot show us if ever they can become living spirits on Middle-Earth if ever someone killed 'their enveloppe', i wonder 

who the heck is Sauron???? 

What kind of creature can survive such monumental deaths and stick to the living world thanks to a ring and the power of his hard feelings. A sorcerer cannot commend such spiritualisation or dematerialisation...and Sauron is obviously the first and only of his kind...He used to be responsible for the betrayal of the Edain towards the Ban of the Valar, he was a prisoner and must have dealt man to man with the kings of this first (or was it second?) age. So he must have been some dark king edain of the eastern territories or something....


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## Legolam (Feb 12, 2002)

Sauron is a Maia, a demi-god second only to the godlike Valar (like Morgoth). He was Morgoth's servant and took over his evil duties. The wizards are also Maia. The Sil (which I've just started reading) has a lot more information in it.


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## Lantarion (Feb 12, 2002)

Yes, and I must order you to read the Silmarillion immediately, unless you are finishing of the LotR. It contains lots of interesting information, great events, marvellous characters etc. In the beginning of the Sil, in what is called the _Ainulindalë_ (the song of the Ainur), it explains how the Universe was created, and how Arda was created, and how the Ainur were created. Ainur were organized into two major groups: the Valar: they were the 'Lords of the West' who lived most of their time in Valinor, and they were the Aínur who chose to descend upon Arda and help it flourish; and the Maiar, who were the 'helpers' of the vassals of the Valar. They were lesser gods, with less power and wisdom, but they too were very powerful. Balrogs (originally named _Valaraukar_) are Maiar, and they were of the ones that were corrupted by Melkor. The Istari, the Wizards of Middle-Earth, are also Maiar, but of less potency, although they have more knowldge and intelligence than the Balrogs.

Wow, rammmbling. Anyway, Sauron was one of the corrupted Maiar, whom Melkor seduced into his thraldom. Sauron was given greater powers, and was given control of his armies (or something like that; he was Melkor's chief Captain OSLT).


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## Kraas (Feb 13, 2002)

Are you wondering about the appearance, too? Well, then, remember this: Sauron is NOT a big red disembodied eye! He could easily shape-shift, changing his form at will. Sauron used this power to get the knowledge of how to make Rings of Power from Celebrimbor, making himself appear fair and friendly, and taking the name of Annatar, Elvish for 'Lord of Gifts'. However, after being caught in the wreck of Numenor, he lost the power of shape-shifting, and could never appear fair in the eyes of the Speaking-Peoples or trick them in the manner he did to Celebrimbor.


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## BluestEye (Feb 14, 2002)

*Sauron - Spoiler...*

Another point to notice about Sauron is that he actualy never appears in the three volums of the Lord of The Rings...!!! How does he look like? What is his skin color? What is his hair color? What robes does he wear? Is he tall? Is he thin or fat? What does his voice sounds like?

And another thing: He always disappears into energy, fades into the wind, when he is defeated. It happened in the Battle with the Valar, it happened when Numenor fell, it happened in the battle of the last aliance and it happened at the end of the LOTR. And if I am not mistaken, Gandalf mentioned something at the end of the Return of the King that suggests that Sauron is not defeated for good and it is probable that he may return...

Some things to meditate about 

Love,
BluestEye


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## Grond (Feb 14, 2002)

As a matter of fact BluestEye, we have only one eye-witness account of anyone seeing Sauron and that would have been Gollum in describing Sauron's missing digit on one hand. But, surely Denethor, Saruman and Aragorn beheld Sauron through the palantari in their possession. There just was never description given. Too bad, I would have liked to know exactly what the old guy looked like.


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## Lantarion (Feb 14, 2002)

That's _palantir_, Grondie-boy. 
I don't see how Gollum, or anybody else could have seen Sauron in any form except a flaming Eye, because he could not take any kind of physical shape in all the Third Age!


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## Grond (Feb 14, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Pontifex _
> *That's palantir, Grondie-boy.
> I don't see how Gollum, or anybody else could have seen Sauron in any form except a flaming Eye, because he could not take any kind of physical shape in all the Third Age! *


I used the plural palantari because there were more than one. Maybe my grammar's not so good but I was meaning to use the plural.

As for your second assertion. Where'd you get that idea from? Sauron most certainly had a physical manifestation in the Third Age. Gollum saw him and was witness to the fact that he only had nine fingers. The quote from the Akallabeth states that Sauron was never ever able to take a form that was fair in appearance, it didn't say he could no longer take form. I don't have any of my books with me but I will give you the info out of the Sil, UT and the Letters to name a few that make it clear Sauron was manifested in body and not just spirit during the War of the Ring. Of course, I'm sure someone else will beat me to it. *Hey Cian, Tar-Elenion, Shagrat-U, anybody!!*


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## Cian (Feb 14, 2002)

Yep, the 'evidence' (consistent with itself and LotR Imo) from Letters is that Sauron was (ultimately) a "physical" being in the Third Age. He was always 'de-bodied' when vanquished (saith the Prof)

I think Ponti means _Palantír(i)_ Grond


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## Ståle (Feb 14, 2002)

True that Sauron had a tendency to fade, but at the end of the Third Age, he lost most of his power as the ring was destroyed. So he could never come back, onlt gnaw on himself in the shawdows.


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