# Is turin the one who inherited the power of tulkas?



## Turin_Turambar (May 4, 2021)

Is there any source that the turin turambar inherited the power of tulkas? one site said it was rumored that the turin inherited the power of tulkas.is it true?


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (May 4, 2021)

It might have been rumored in Middle-earth, but I don't recall ever reading it.

I'm not sure how a human could "inherit" power from a Vala.


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## Olorgando (May 4, 2021)

If Túrin had "inherited" the power of Tulkas, the attack on Nargothrond by Morgoth's forced led by Glaurung would have ended in their utter annihilation. Túrin would have used Glaurung as a fly-, or in this case Orc-swatter, reducing the lot to a bloody pulp, and left what remained of Glaurung tied up in a very complicated sailor's knot.

I'm thinking of what The Hulk did to Loki in the "Marvel's Avengers" film of 2012.


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## m4r35n357 (May 5, 2021)

Ecthelion Of The Fountain said:


> Is there any source that the turin turambar inherited the power of tulkas? one site said it was rumored that the turin inherited the power of tulkas.is it true?


Why not name & shame the site?


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## Turin_Turambar (May 5, 2021)

m4r35n357 said:


> Neden siteyi adlandırıp utandırmayasınız?


turkish wikipedia.(really i am serious.)


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## Olorgando (May 5, 2021)

The only thing that seems vaguely likely is JRRT envisioning Túrin as returning for the Final Battle at the end of Arda, when Melko(r) has managed to escape the void, and, as per "The Book of Lost Tales 2" (History of Middle-earth volume 2) page 116 (1986 paperback reprint):

"... but Turambar indeed shall stand beside Fionwë in the Great Wrack, and Melko and his drakes shall curse the sword of Mormakil."

Or in HoMe volume 4 "The Shaping of Middle-earth", page 40 (1988 paperback reprint):

"Fionwë will fight Morgoth on the plain of Valinor, and the spirit of Túrin shall be beside him; it shall be Túrin who with his black sword will slay (!!!) Morgoth, and thus the children of Húrin shall be avenged."

In the published Silmarillion and all other published matter dealing with it, it is unfailingly Tulkas whom Melko / Melkor / Morgoth etc. is terrified of, and rightly so, as Tulkas is practically always the one that pummels him into submission and ties him up with that chain Angainor. That Túrin is said to *also* be Morgoth's bane at the end of Arda might lead to the erroneous assumption of an "inheritance".


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## m4r35n357 (May 5, 2021)

Ah, OK, there is an updated version of that passage in paragraph 31 of the Quenta Silmarillion (vol. 5).

"In that day Tulkas shall strive with Morgoth, and on his right hand shall be Fionwe, and on his left Turin Turambar, son of Hurin, coming from the halls of Mandos; and the black sword of Turin shall deal unto Morgoth his death and final end; and so shall the children of Hurin and all Men be avenged."

Long sentence!


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## Olorgando (May 5, 2021)

m4r35n357 said:


> Long sentence!


Have you read anything by Thomas Mann, Germany's Nobel Prize laureate in Literature for 1929?!? Especially in the original? 
He would probably have sniffed at SMS (originally 160 characters) or tweets (originally 140 characters) as "something sufficient for preschoolers!" 😂


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## m4r35n357 (May 5, 2021)

Hehe, I have just checked vol. 11, and that passage is mostly retained in the post-LotR Quenta Silmarillion:

"Turin Turambar, son of Hurin, coming from the halls of Mandos"

becomes

"Turin Turambar, son of Hurin, returning from the Doom of Men at the ending of the world"

and that is the final word (apart from a marginal note: "and Beren Camlost").


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## Oromedur (May 5, 2021)

Ecthelion Of The Fountain said:


> Is there any source that the turin turambar inherited the power of tulkas? one site said it was rumored that the turin inherited the power of tulkas.is it true?


There is (I think) a version where Turin becomes a Vala after the Dagor Dagorath, but not exactly canon.


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## Elthir (May 5, 2021)

m4r35n357 said:


> "Turin Turambar, son of Hurin, returning from the Doom of Men at the ending of the world"
> 
> and that is the final word (apart from a marginal note: "and Beren Camlost").



An even later idea connected with prophecy has Túrin returning at the end of the First Age, to slay Ancalagon.

The context of the return you are noting is the Second Prophecy of Mandos of course, which was abandoned _as a prophecy from the Vala Mandos_ (see the end of the 1977 Silmarillion), and anything at the end of Quenta Silmarillion regarding the end of the world was to be seen as mannish myth (see Morgoth's Ring, note 7 to the commentary on _Athrabeth Finrod Ah Andreth_) -- but the end of QS was not updated with respect to this later conception so [that's possibly why] Christopher Tolkien did not include it . . .

. . . and the slaying of Ancalagon by Túrin (not Earendil here) is noted in a prophecy given by Andreth the Wise.


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