# The form of the Nazgul?



## Úlairi (Mar 29, 2002)

In the movie Saruman says that the Nazgul have taken the form of riders clad in black. I am unsure as to if it says this also somewhere in LoTR. If they have "taken forms of riders clad in black" then what are their normal forms? What do they usually look like? Can anyone answer this?


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## Strider97 (Mar 29, 2002)

They are formless wraiths. They are only visible by their black robes and their weapons.


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## Goro Shimura (Mar 29, 2002)

I think Bakshi was more true to the Book.

The armor in the movie was frightening-- but having just a hunched over sniffling figure is much more eerie.

I think hunched over and twisted... maybe even with boots that don't quite seem to fit is more like it. (Quasimodo gone Goth?)

Anyway... the movie Nazgul had posture that was just way too good.


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## Tao (Mar 29, 2002)

I would think that the Nazgul were unformed wraiths, like Strider97 said. But before they were kings of men, not wraiths. And the movie portrays them as kings when Frodo puts the ring on. Also they probably lost all shape when they were transformed by greed of the rings.


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## Strider97 (Mar 29, 2002)

Absolutely TAO,

As they wore the rings they faded from sight. After they faded Sauron took the rings and held them. The Nazgul lost all form while seeking the rings that Sauron held. They had no form but fear was in front of then and followed where they left.


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## Tao (Mar 29, 2002)

I completely agree, strider!

The Nazgul were overcome by the rings and Sauron, and eventually lost all form and shape.


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## Úlairi (Mar 29, 2002)

That is an interesting concept Tao and Strider97, but wouldn't have been more effective if they went invisible and took the Ring from Frodo? I mean it would have been a lot easier for them and once they had got it: GAME OVER!!!


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## Greenwood (Mar 30, 2002)

I believe that when Tolkien says the Nazgul need their black robes to give them "form" he means that they are invisible (in other words they have no visible form), not that they are truly shapeless under their cloaks. From The Shadow of the Past chapter in FOTR (I just posted this on another thread), Gandalf speaking:

"A mortal Frodo, who keeps one of the Great Rings, does not die, but he does not grow or obtain more life, he merely continues, until at last every minute is a weariness. And if he often uses the Ring to make himself invisible, he _fades_: he becomes in the end invisible permanently, and walks in the twilight under the eye of the dark power that rules the Rings. Yes, sooner or later -- later, if he id dtrong or well-meaning to begin with, but neither strength nor good purpose will last -- sooner or later the dark power will devour him." [italics in original]

Also, when Merry stabs the head Nazgul at the battle of Pelennor Fields, Tolkien describes that Merry's swrod thrust "pierced the sinew behind his might knee". So while the Nazgul may have been invisible under their cloaks, they still had human bodies and form.


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## Khamul (Mar 30, 2002)

And also if I remember correctly, they are more effective cloaked, because they have less terror going before them. If they had been uncloaked then Frodo would be even more terrified and they couldnt have come that close to anyone without them going into shock or something of the sort.


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## greypilgrim (Mar 30, 2002)

the nazgul wore shapes that suited them. you can't kill a nazgul, unless you destroy the one ring, and if you struck down one of them, they lose their shape, and must find another. frodo saw them in their twilight world, and saw them in their true form.


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## Úlairi (Mar 31, 2002)

Exactly greypilgrim, and Greenwood is also correct which is why I posted as to why they didn't go unclad and take the Ring from Frodo. As for Sting's comment, nowhere can I find that they had more ar less terror when they went clad or unclad. In fact, it is quite the opposite of what you have said Sting. Here is a passage in UT explaining this:



> "The Lord of Morgul therefore led his companions over Anduin, unclad and unmounted, and invisible to eyes, and yet a *terror* to all living things that they passed near."



The Nazgul seemed *more* terrifying when they were unclad then when they clad. Sauron's tactics were not in order here. If he had sent the Nazgul unclad, then the One Ring would have been much easier to obtain!


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## Khamul (Apr 1, 2002)

Believe or not, that is what I meant, but my mind slipped or something and I typed the opposite.....


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## Úlairi (Apr 2, 2002)

Don't worry Sting, I believe you!


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