# What fact or attribute do y'all like the most about the Elves?



## DMEII (Sep 27, 2002)

Hey y'all,
What do you like the most about the Elves, or their atributes, etc.? When I first read LOTR and read the part when the hobbits hid and watched a party of Elves go by in the night that the Elves' eyes glowed and shined reflecting the star and moon light and it shimmered about their feet on the ground around them. I think that is neat. In the Silmirilian it says that a lot of the men were afraid of the Elves because of their shining eyes and the light in them. I also like the fact that they seem to be on a higher plane than us, with higher more acute senses, skill with things, etc.. But I suppose one of the main things is that I like the fact that they live and coincide with nature, and love nature and natural things rather than trying to rule, control, and/or destroy


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## Lantarion (Sep 27, 2002)

Their minds, obviously. They seem to be fine-tuned to understand and interact with their surroundings far better than those of Men. 
But after this perplexing organ I would say their eyes, without a doubt.


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## Confusticated (Sep 27, 2002)

Oh come on ANY race that Finrod belongs to has GOT to be the best.. 

Kidding of course... I like their great wisdom. Wisdom is in my opinion one of the best things that a person can have. Another is health, and the elves had this too. I like that the elves were pretty good at taking care of their realms, and that they created beautiful things. For the most part they have their priorities straight. They live life to enjoy it, and they respect the earth. They do not seek to control the world, and seem happy to enjoy life, and reluctant to take things that do not rightfully belong to them. By the end of the third age those elves remaining in middle-earth had great sorrows, from their past and of the present, but they remained a good people. Other races such as men or Valar ....may have decided to take this out on others.


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## Lhunithiliel (Sep 28, 2002)

> What do you like the most about the Elves



What I like best about them is that they are.....*ELVES!!!!* - in all their complexity of physical perfection, wisdom, poetic and tender souls, their skills, their compassion, their courage, their somewhat childish way to accept with awe and wonder the surrounding world, their fierceness when this beautiful world has to be defended... them being ELVES!


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## Aragorn12345 (Sep 28, 2002)

I love the way elves are so connected to nature, loving compassionate, caring , smart, I JUST LOVE ELVES


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## Ceorl (Sep 28, 2002)

Personally I loved the Elves because they are so similar to us and yet so much better; more beautiful, more intelligent, wiser(side-effect of immortality) and more powerful to boot.


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## Melara (Sep 29, 2002)

I like the elves because they are so BEAUTIFUL. They don't only look beautiful, their hearts and minds are good and beautiful, too. Also their sadness and seriousness makes me like them. And I find it positive that they aren't always serious (the elves of Rivendell in The Hobbit!). I'm sure they have a lovely laughter! And those eyes of course...


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## Melian Le Fay (Sep 29, 2002)

The fact that they are enamoured of the stars and the moon... I love the stars and the moon....
And stars in their eyes.... I really missed that in the film!
and their beauty - not so much their superficial beauty, but the inner one - the light that shines within them - the real beauty...
And their love and understanding of the nature - for I love it as well...
Or, just as Lhuthiniel wrote - just beacause they are ....Elves
But what kindles me the most is their bitter-sweet destiny - to perish one day, their everlasting sorrow, their love for Middle Earth, though they have to leave it..... My, that is so sad....


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## DMEII (Sep 29, 2002)

*Elves*

Hey Milena,
You put it perfectly! I feel the same as you and could not have worded it any better. I too wish they had've shown at least once Elves passing in the night with their eyes shining and glowing with the moon and star light and that light glimmering about their feet as they walked. I also wish they had've included Galadrial giving the Fellowship each of their gifts. I really wanted to hear Gimli's eloquent little thankyou speach when Galadrial asked him what he wanted. It surprised the Elves and all present because of his usual gruff manner. There after noone could say any thing bad about Galadrial in his presence. 
Dave


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## LúthienTinúviel (Sep 30, 2002)

I love their sorrowful, wise beauty and their deep connection to the world around them. It is the doom of the elves to be bound to the fate of the world and the striking juxtaposition of the love they bear for the world and their weariness of it is heartrending.

And this aspect which I love most about them is perhaps most eloquently and poignantly depicted in Tolkien's poetry.

Here's an excerpt from "Elven Hymn to Elbereth Gilthoniel"



> O Elbereth! Gilthoniel!
> We still remember, we who dwell
> In this far land beneath the trees,
> Thy starlight on the Western Seas.



and here is "Song for the Sea"



> To the Sea, to the Sea! The white gulls are crying,
> The wind is blowing, and the white foam is flying.
> West, west away, the round sun is falling.
> Grey ship, grey ship, do you hear them calling,
> ...


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## Melian Le Fay (Oct 1, 2002)

DME II, 
I also agree they should have put at least a little scene with Elves walking in the night...that would be so enchanting to see!
And as for Galadriel's gifts, the scenes where the Felloship is getting them is made, and should be included in the 30-minutes longer edition...
But they never filmed the scene when Gimli asks for her golden hair...too bad, they really missed the best thing about the gifts!   

Luthien, 
those poems you quoted actually make me cry... now, that's something that happens seldomly! I first felt sorry for the men, for their fate is alos sad... and sometimes unjust... but then I realised that the elves never got the better part of the bargain, their fate is equally sorrowfull as the one of men, it's just different...
First I thought Elves were leaving ME just because they felt weary, but afterwords I realised they were leaving it because that was their only way to avoid uttermost fading...the only way they were left to let go of the sorrow that surrounded them.... And they DID love ME, yet they had to leave it... Hmmm... they turned into a legend....
but what gives me "hope" is that, although they were so sorrowfull, and had to leave for good, they are still "out there"....
that, and Tolkien's idea of the world's end - the world will be remade, and elves young again, sorrow lifted from their hearts...
Yippy - yay - yey!!!


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## Maeglin (Oct 4, 2002)

Few reach knowledge, fewer reach understanding, and even fewer reach wisdom. The elves are the few that had wisdom, thats what I like best about them.


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 8, 2002)

I like the pointy ears. I know it's superficial and stupid...but for some reason I've always wanted pointy ears...
That and their serenity...Legolas was always so calm and fearless...it's a power I wish I had because I'm so emotional and distraught and hectic all the time.
The elves were so calm...so behaved...so able to deal.
I can't deal...that's why I wish I were an elf.


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## Melian Le Fay (Oct 9, 2002)

OMG, you've completely read my thoughts!!!! Everyting, from the pointy ears to serenety (I just love that Legolas' behaviour )....
But I suppose after few thousand years, everyone becomes serene and able to deal things!!!


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 9, 2002)

I think I'd probably still be a mess...I'm certainly no better at dealing at 19 than I was at 9. I still cry like a baby when I get my heart hurt...and I still cry..wait...ALL the time. 

I can't deal...I wish I could be an elf...plus they have an inner beauty...they glow with the light of the Eldar. It's gorgeous.


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## Melian Le Fay (Oct 9, 2002)

So, you're older than 15? That's a surprise! Oohh...I ment... most of the people I met here are 12, 13... I feel ooooold around them!!!   

Inner beauty! I guess a man could never act an Elf. This inner beauty literally manifests as a divine light that shines in them...sigh....


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## JanitorofAngmar (Oct 9, 2002)

I'm with Glorfindal1187. It's the wisdom of the elves that is attractive. Wisdom is probably the most elusive thing in all mankind (IMHO).

Either that or the fact that they drink like fish.


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## Melian Le Fay (Oct 9, 2002)

Drink like fish?!!!!!!! Oh, my, this just shattered my image of Elves as high beings.... 
Are you refering to "the Hobbit"? I thouhgt I read there some Elves got drunk... 


p.s. I like your name! And that which is written below it! And your avatar!!! LOL


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 9, 2002)

And who doesn't want to be able to drink like a fish?  

And yes I am, in fact, not 15.  Go me!

As far as the Elvish wisdom is concerned I'd agree that it is one of their most intriguing qualities, but I wonder, is it really the most elusive of all human qualities? I'm not sure.


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## Melian Le Fay (Oct 9, 2002)

Yes! Look at Plato, Aristotel, Leonardo, Descartes, Voltaire, Russel....

Oh, by the way, I haven't got a clue what "elusive" means, so I'll probably have to erase this stupid post....  

Unless it means what I think it means... in that case I won't delete it!


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## JanitorofAngmar (Oct 9, 2002)

Millena,

Yeah really! Check my other posts. All the real "dirt" on ME you could ever ask for! Tom, the Elves, the inner workings of Mordor, most of it's there! We just get the J.R.R.T.'s "sanitized" version of it. You should see the rated R version of LOTR. 

Wonko,

I would argue that in fact it is. I feel that wisdom leads to many more of the more admirable qualities in humans. For example, wisdom would dictate that to survive we must take care of each other cause the whole is stronger than it's individual parts (synergy, 1+1=3, etc.). As a result this would foster a humanitarian attitude in what we do would it not? Also by maintaining diversity and tollerance we allow for a greater realm of solutions to the globe's problems, right? If we all think like baby Bush, where does that get us when confronted by something that requires a solution outside of the "groupthink" mode.

So the wisdom could come first followed by more desireable characteristics of humanity such as compassion, and tollerance, etc.

That's just an example but do you get what I'm trying to say (poorly I might add)? Hence my opinion on wisdom.

Any thoughts?

JoA


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 9, 2002)

Well, I agree that wisdom is hard to come buy in such a race as ours. And I also agree that wisdom leads to all the things you described here.

But at the same time, there are so many other attributes that seem to be equally elusive.

How about true, unselfish, unconditional love?

How about genuine maturity? You can't have wisdom without that.

How about an honest interest in the well-being of mankind? That's pretty elusive.

Or what about, serenity and the strength to accept change?

What about a working knowledge of Radiohead, Tolkien, AND Douglas Adams? Huh?

To say it's "the most elusive" seems to be generalizing and trivializing a lot of other qualities. But I agree wholeheartedly with your sentiments on the necessity of wisdom.


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## JanitorofAngmar (Oct 9, 2002)

Yes wouldn't true, unselfish, unconditional love come from faith rather than wisdom? Hence, if that is what you value (I do!) then "faith" would be more important wouldn't it? Unconditional love would 99% of the time be between parent and child though and rarely from a couple. I mean how unconditional is it if your spouse cheats on you and you leave them instead of forgive them? That would be part of unconditional love, right? So it would be based on faith rather than convention.

And I would have to argue that maturity comes with wisdom, right?

I would also argue that change is inevitable, therefore, accepting it would come from wisdom to know the inevitability of change.

Yeah, well-being of man, serenity, and strength...where would they come from? Your upbringing? Socialization? Hmmm...


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 9, 2002)

Well you can be mature, and not wise. But I don't think you can be wise and not mature so you may be right on that one.

The connection between unconditional-love and faith is sketchy though. If you mean faith in God I disagree. If you mean faith in love, forgivness, the other person, or your own feelings then I definitely agree. 

The thing about change though, is I don't really think you have to be wise to accept its inevitability. I'd argue that cases can present themselves where someone is stoic enough to accept change, but not truly wise.


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## JanitorofAngmar (Oct 9, 2002)

First point - yup! I like the way you reason!

Second point - Noooo, not the God thing.

Third point - Yeah, you've swayed me....I agree.

Fourth point - OW! That's sharp!!!!


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 10, 2002)

When I first read that I was like...Fourth point...I didn't MAKE a fourth point..and then I realized you were being weird...
Kudos!


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## JanitorofAngmar (Oct 10, 2002)

Yeah, "trying" to be funny....

Trying hard anyway....

failing hard too...


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 10, 2002)

Just a note, JoA...don't ever be a comedian, k?


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## Eledhwen (Oct 10, 2002)

*What do I like most about Elves?*

Their timelessness. It is that which allows their arts to develop to a level that short-lived man calls "magic". It is living for thousands of years that supplies the wisdom. Galadriel in the Silmarillion was young and ambitious (by the way, Wonko, Cait Blanchett said she always wanted pointy ears!), but by the time Frodo offered her the Ring, she had the wisdom to decline it.

As a Christian, I expect one day to leave this world of the dying and enter a world where I too can really live forever, without ageing, in glorious surroundings - no pointy ears though, as far as I know.


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 10, 2002)

See! Cate Blanchett and I aren't to different...both undeniably gorgeous, both irresistable, both exceptionally talented actresses, both want pointy ears... It's a good thing.


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## Morgaphry (Oct 11, 2002)

The IMMORTALITY!!!!

Morgaphry


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## Melian Le Fay (Oct 12, 2002)

But are the Elves _really_ immortal....? Their lives are bound to earth, Arda, and when it ends, I suppose they will end, too...


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## Lantarion (Oct 12, 2002)

Oh, Elves are aren't immortal; they just live until the World ends.


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## Eledhwen (Oct 14, 2002)

I can't find anywhere where it says that because the Elves remain alive to the world's end (or until all things are made new), that they are then obliterated. It wouldn't fit in with Tolkien's love of the Elves or with his own theology.


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 14, 2002)

I was always under the impression that the world of the Valar and the Undying lands were not part of the Earth in the sense that Middle-Earth is, and that the destruction of Middle-Earth would not necessarily mean the destruction of the Elvish "heaven"...so then...wouldn't the elves, Valar, Maiar, etc. continue to live on even if the physical world was ended?


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## Tyaronumen (Oct 14, 2002)

Well, the spirits of the beings would certainly continue to exist, but even though Aman was "removed" in the sense that Mortal Men could no longer reach it, Aman was still a part of the finite world, "Ea", and it's inhabitants were likely subject to the final fate of the wider world...


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 15, 2002)

Oh right...because Iluvatar bound up the spirits of the Valar into Earth and made Earth's fate their fate...so the Valar would end as the world ends, right?
But what about Elves? Obviously men don't have that gift...but would the Elves live on? Or are they tied into the fate of the earth as well?


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## Eledhwen (Oct 15, 2002)

> ...so the Valar would end as the world ends, right?


 I don't believe so. I think the Valar are bound to the earth, but are released from that bondage when the world ends and do not perish with it.


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## Wonko The Sane (Oct 15, 2002)

It says in the Ainulindale that when Iluvatar gave the Ainur the choice to descend to earth those that did had "Their power should thenceforward be contained and bounded in the world, to be within it forever, until it is complete, so that they are its life and it is theirs."

So when the world ends...aren't they then extinguished too because "they are its life and it is theirs"?


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## Melian Le Fay (Nov 3, 2002)

But what IS the ultimate fate of Arda?!
Will it be undone, or............?
Because in HOME, there are several versions of the Final battle and the end of Arda, and in few of them (2 actually, I think) the world will be remade with Dwarves' help, and the Ainur and Elves will be young again, and the ultimate fate of men has several versions.........
Now hwat about that? If the world will be remade, then Elves (and Ainur) will not perish......they will be immortal indeed!  
Has anyone got any ideas?


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## Eriol (Nov 4, 2002)

No ideas on the end of the world, sorry  

On Elves, though... I think what attracts me in them is their outlook, something which is not quite wisdom, since it is there even in "unwise" elves (Feänor, for instance). The realization that you will live forever, and you can make plans that last for ages... no mere man would have made an Oath like his. It is this "timelessness" that draws me the most, since it is completely alien to our own outlook. Remember the plea that Húrin made to Turgon, asking to be released from Gondolin -- something like "our lives are not like those of the Eldar, and we don't have much time, and soon wither and die"... 

(You can see I like the Silmarillion A LOT  )


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## Ascamaciliel (Nov 5, 2002)

i like how Tolkien emphasized their eyes as well, and their fighting skills


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## Melian Le Fay (Nov 7, 2002)

The Eyes, oh the Eyes!!!! Can you imagine looking into eyes that look like stars and radiate gentle, beautiful light! I'd probably fall in love right away!!!   
Oh, and I was thrilled with the fighting scenes in the film! I think they've done a grat job! Legolas was just perfect... I wish I could move like that...

And Eriol, who doesn't like The Sil a lot?!?!?!


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