# Did Eru know?



## _postman (Sep 29, 2010)

Hello

I wonder if someone can shed any light on this, please?

Did Eru create Melkor fully conscious of the evil that was to befall the different ages of Middle-earth?

Thanks.

_postman


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## Confusticated (Sep 29, 2010)

There is no known answer to such a question.

It comes down to how each person wants to view it.

I think Iluvatar did not know when he created the Ainur that Melkor was going to do what he did. I think it was more like an act of artistic creation where all the different parts of his mind just came out and were expressed through the Ainur. More of an art than a science, where it might have been planned out like that. It was almost as though the creation expressed (among other things) a conflict within Iluvatar himself. In this case he would know the end but maybe not every details of the means. But I don't know any more than the next person.


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## vladut50 (Jan 24, 2011)

I think that the Ainur were part of the thought of Eru, so they were like part of his brain or consciousness ....I do not think he could destroy or control the Ainur fully. That is why Melkor made so many bad stuff. Am I right?


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## Telchar (Jan 24, 2011)

If Eru is seen as the God of Eä where Ambar exists, I would have to say yes, Eru knew.

This is just my personal view, but i base them on;



> There was Eru, the One, who in Arda is called Ilúvatar; and he made first the Ainur, the Holy Ones, that where the offspring of his though......





> And thou, Melkor, shalt see that no theme maybe played that hath not it's uttermost source in me, nor can any alter the music in my despite. For he that attempteth this shall prove but mine instrument in the devising of things more wonderful, which he himself hath not imagined..



In those two quotes from Silmarillion I find Eru to be the God of Eä and thus would know the future of Melkor, even before he was created. As I see this it boils down to how you perceive Eru.


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## vladut50 (Jan 25, 2011)

Let's say he knew what Melkor would do. Could he not create Melkor anymore, if he knew what he would do? No....because then, the foreseeing of Morgoth's bad deeds would become false.....is not that simple to be the god of Ea :*)...you cannot just cancel things (joking)...... Anyway, Melkor was created by Tolkien with a purpose and he had to exist in order to make things interesting. If everything had been good, and no evil was in Arda, all Tolkien's legendarium would have been boring.:*p


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