# prosody in poems and riddles



## frenchteacher (Mar 11, 2005)

Hello,
I need you. I am not an expert in English poetry? I know better French prosody.
Could you explain to me the rythm used in the riddles (chapter 5) ? 
Does Tolkien use iamb, trochee, spondee, dactyl and anapest ?
Thanks

French Teacher


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## David Pence (Mar 11, 2005)

If I'm not mistaken, Tolkien's 'prose' was in a style known as 'Alliterative Accentual Verse,' which is basically the style of poetry found during the 'Old' to 'Middle English' periods. Works such as "Sir Gawain and the Green Knight," and "Beowulf" (both translated by Tolkien) use this style of poetry.

When two or more words in a line start with the same sound, that's known as 'Alliteration.'

Alliterative poetry, is based on how the each word in the poem begins, not so much on the use of rhyme or syllables.

I could be wrong, so let's see if our more poetically inclined members can shed some light on this topic.


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## Eledhwen (Jun 16, 2005)

Sorry, no, not me. I'm as thick as two short planks when it comes to labelling types of poetry or prose.


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## Hobbit-queen (Jun 26, 2005)

Ooooo...you know French? Well, my great grandfather was french. My last name is Bebout (Bibeau in French). Anyway, I can't help you too much with the rythms and riddles.


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## Eledhwen (Jun 27, 2005)

The metre and rhyming varies from riddle to riddle. It could be these variations that confused Gollum into allowing Bilbo's non-riddle question at the end.


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## Firawyn (Jun 29, 2005)

I'm not sure there is a consistent rythm. I should expect it was simply free verse. *shrugs* I don't know.

Fir-


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## Arlina (Jul 11, 2005)

Eledhwen said:


> The metre and rhyming varies from riddle to riddle. It could be these variations that confused Gollum into allowing Bilbo's non-riddle question at the end.



Exactly, both Biblo and Gollum's rhyming metre change for each riddle they say. Gollumn's first metre is fashioned after A-A-B-B, Bilbo's is A-B-B-A. Gollumn's second metre is A-B-A-B where as Bilbo's is A-A-B-B-C-C, and so forth. But I'm not sure if there is anything else to the riddles then that...sorry, I'm not that good with rhymes and riddles either...


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## PaigeSinclaire88 (Dec 16, 2016)

frenchteacher said:


> Hello,
> I need you. I am not an expert in English poetry? I know better French prosody.
> Could you explain to me the rythm used in the riddles (chapter 5) ?
> Does Tolkien use iamb, trochee, spondee, dactyl and anapest ?
> ...




Tolkiens influences were Beowulf and Sir Gawain the Green knight, Tolkien translated both and he was a scholar on language so he used his extensive knowledge of language to write the poems and riddles in his tales. It was this knowledge that inspired the languages of his races in LOTR's and The Hobbit.


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