# Elves, Beards and Cycles of Life



## Aragorn (Sep 30, 2008)

While reading an article about Mahtan (the father ofhttp://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Nerdanel Nerdanel, the wife ofhttp://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Fëanor Fëanor) I found out :

“…Mahtan had a beard, which was unusual for an Elf, especially one as young as he. According to Tolkien, most Elves could only grow beards from the "third cycle" of their lives, while Mahtan was an exception in being only early in his second.”

How could you imagine an elf with a beard? But the most unclear question is:
What do these “cycles” refer to?


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## Ithrynluin (Sep 30, 2008)

Phases in an elf's life. I don't think there are any set boundaries for each phase, but I reckon an elf in his third phase would have to be pretty old, though not necessarily ancient.


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## Elthir (Sep 30, 2008)

Círdan had a beard too.

Anyway, Tolkien does not elaborate on the 'cycles' (that we yet know of, this note was published in Vinyar Tengwar, a linguistic journal), though I suppose one could speculate.


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## YayGollum (Sep 30, 2008)

And didn't Gwindor have a beard, in at least one version of the story? Or mayhaps there was some other deleted elf with a beard? Something about how the fact that he'd been enslaved by Mel made him look like an old human. I totally have a character like that, so I must have been sure when I made him up. 

To answer the questions at the beginning, though ---> 

1. With my imagination.
2. Oh. Dang. That was already answered. My speculation on what the cycles are ---> From infancy to young adulthood, at a little slower rate than a human, very slow (capitalized Ages long, apparently) advancement from young adulthood to geriatrichood, then geriatrichood, which is quite happily without much senility or weakness, except for humans laughing at their pathetically patchy beards.


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## Elthir (Sep 30, 2008)

YayGollum said:


> And didn't Gwindor have a beard, in at least one version of the story?


 
In an early painting Tolkien drew Beleg and Gwindor, but it was Beleg who was bearded there anyway. In any case that was quite early, in 1928, and I'm not sure that later Tolkien would have thought Beleg was in his third cycle of life (and thus perhaps he was going to lose his beard in theory).

Over the years Tolkien's ideas about Elves changed, as did the terminology he used in reference to them. Examples include the very early notion of Elven faded 'diminutiveness' or their relative tallness in comparison to Men. Possibly JRRT later refined the issue of beards, and certainly he changed the way Elves reincarnated. And again possibly he even changed his idea on the shape of Quendian ears. Or Tolkien expanded or refined something, like Eldarin hair color. 

JRRT actually chose this painting for publication, but characterizing the illustration as Fangorn Forest suggests to me that these beings are 'now' (as far as Tolkien himself _publishing_ a depiction of Elves anyway) not to be considered Beleg and Gwindor at least -- though I'm not sure who they are then supposed to be! if one looks close enough.


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## YayGollum (Sep 30, 2008)

I found the quote. I hate looking those things up. Makes me look like I can't be trusted to know what I'm typing about.  "At first his own people did not know Gwindor, who went out young and strong, and returned now seeming as one of the aged among mortal Men, because of his torments and his labours;" So it doesn't specifically inform that he had a beard. Maybe there's some other quote? I am unsure. 

Towards Beleg having a beard, it could still make sense. A point is made about him not having a father. Why? There should have still been plenty of elves around from Cuivienen, at this time, and it doesn't seem like too common of a title. As well as, he is painted as a decently sized chunk of better than the average elf. I type that he's an Ainur type thing. No father, better than the average elf, and, just like Aule making a mistake with what capitalized Children were supposed to look like, sporting freakish facial hair. *sage nod*


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## Alcuin (Oct 1, 2008)

Galin said:


> In an early painting Tolkien drew Beleg and Gwindor, but it was Beleg who was bearded there anyway.


_Tolkien Artist & Illustrator_, Hammond & Scull, plate 54. I had the old 1974 Tolkien Calendar, where it is labeled “Fangorn Forest.” I missed that: I had always believed it was Merry & Pippin.

The painting was originally painted in 1928, according to Hammond & Scull. They explain in the text (p 55: plate & page numbers are separate) that the painting was for _The Book of Ishness_, and that “Gwindor” was then called “Flinding.” Flinding has “a red elvish cap and … one of the ‘little lanterns of lucent crystal / and silver cold’” (probably what is later called a “Fëanorian lamp”). An examination of the plate reveals that he is also face-down beneath the bole of the tree, so we cannot see if Flinding/Gwindor also had a beard in 1928 or not.

A hunt around the internet for a specific reference to the _Vinyar Tengwar_ article indicated that the material there might have dated from 1960. The article appeared in volume 41 and is entitled “From _The Shibboleth of Fëanor_,” edited by Carl F. Hostetter.

Tinfang Gelion, a piper of Doriath who played for Lúthien in _Lays of Beleriand,_ “The Lay of Leithian,” line 503, has a name, “Tinfang,” that might mean “twilight beard.” That doesn’t prove he actually had a beard, though, or that I have correctly interpreted the word _Tinfang_.


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## Elthir (Oct 1, 2008)

Alcuin said:


> Tinfang Gelion, a piper of Doriath who played for Lúthien in _Lays of Beleriand,_ “The Lay of Leithian,” line 503, has a name, “Tinfang,” that might mean “twilight beard.” That doesn’t prove he actually had a beard, though, or that I have correctly interpreted the word _Tinfang_.


 
I didn't check the _Lays_, but in the _Gnomish Lexicon_ the name appears to contain timp 'a hoot, a note of a flute or a small bell' (compare his Qenya name). Fang is a word too, for 'long beard', but the Gnomish Lexicon has two forms Tinfing or Tinfang with the words 'the fluter' next to these. 

Hmmm.


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## Alcuin (Oct 1, 2008)

I do not have “Gnomish Lexicon” (from _Parma Eldalamberon_?)

“Flutter” would make more sense, since in the text, “Tinfang Gelion” is also called “Tinfang Warbler.”


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## Elthir (Oct 1, 2008)

Sorry *Alcuin*, that should be _'the fluter'_ rather (not 'flutter'). I will edit this in my previous post too. Not sure how that happened. Oops.

And yes, the _Gnomish Lexicon_ is published in Parma Eldalamberon No. 11


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## Hobbit-GalRosie (Feb 22, 2009)

Thank goodness someone got an answer about this, I've been trying to for a long time with no luck, which makes sense since little or nothing more is known about it.

I sometimes do picture Tinfang as having a beard, something small and neat...he seems like such a different creature to Tolkien's later Elves...


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