# "So, Gandalf, you try to lead them over Caradhras." - Saruman, are you Psychic?



## HarryTheWhite (Oct 9, 2016)

In Fellowship Of The Ring, the fellowship are forced to hide to not be seen by Saruman's spies, the Crebain from Dunland. One thing that I find odd, is that Saruman sent a whole flock of Crebain to spy on the fellowship.* Couldn't he have simply sent one or two, to avoid the fellowship noticing, leading them to go through the gap of Rohan?* This would have taken them "too close" to Isengard, which Saruman would have wanted, as he intended to get the ring, so being caught would've made them switch paths, which i will get onto. *Did Saruman want the fellowship to take another path? And if so, Why?*
Lastly, I found it slightly strange that Saruman (Although being the White Wizard, highest in the order) could so accurately predict that the fellowship would take the path over Caradhras, whilst barely knowing anything about their plans. All he has seen is that the fellowship are heading toward the gap of Rohan, and im sure that it is not enough information to determine their path, for I'm sure that there are many other paths they could've taken to get to Minas Tirith, which in case you were unaware, is where Saruman is supposed in believing the fellowship were heading (according to my research)*. So how does Saruman know that this is where they were heading? Is it luck? Or did he make his influence in that area aware to the fellowship, in an attempt to get them to pass over the mountain?
*
Any answers or theories to these inquiries would be much appreciated. Also a heads up that I have not read the LOTR books, all of my knowledge of the matter is purely based on the Peter Jackson film adaptation and research that i have done.


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## Starbrow (Oct 10, 2016)

I don't think Saruman had total control over the Crebain. He could ask them to fly around and report what they see, but they would still act like birds and fly in a flock. 

As for knowing which route the Fellowship would take, there weren't a lot of options to choose from. He could make the reasonable prediction that they are headed to Minas Tirith and what the most likely path would be.


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## CirdanLinweilin (Oct 11, 2016)

I'm with Starbrow, however, I think Saruman would like people to think he's psychic, maybe as a way of keeping soldiers in line or his enemies in worry and or fear.

He may actually be, or may not, but as a way of intimidation, he makes people think so.


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## HarryTheWhite (Oct 18, 2016)

Thanks for your responses, but one thing i still dont understand (If Saruman isn't psychic) is why he would think the fellowship would be going over the mountain, rather than the seemingly obvious route through the gap of Rohan. He never saw the fellowship head toward the mountain, only toward the gap of Rohan, which wouldve been ideal for him as it brings them closer to Isengard.


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## CirdanLinweilin (Oct 18, 2016)

That is a very good question. I'm not sure, I'm going to have to reread that chapter.


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## CirdanLinweilin (Oct 18, 2016)

Sorry, I'm not much help. It's quite puzzling to me as well.


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## mallos (Oct 19, 2016)

As far as I gathered from reading the relevant chapter, he didn't know. The mountain, after all, is heavily implied to be fighting them because if its own malevolent spirit.
The only person suggested to be causing the snow is Sauron, as seen here:


> I wonder if this is a contrivance of the Enemy,’ said Boromir. ‘They say in my land that he can govern the storms in the Mountains of Shadow that stand upon the borders of Mordor. He has strange powers and many allies.’
> ‘His arm has grown long indeed,’ said Gimli, ‘if he can draw snow down from the North to trouble us here three hundred leagues away.’
> ‘His arm has grown long,’ said Gandalf.


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## Deleted member 12094 (Oct 29, 2016)

Let me put in my own 5 cents.

Saruman knew that the Black Riders were looking for the Shire (they had told him so themselves) so he suspected that the Shire had something to do with the coveted Ring and therefore also that Gandalf probably knew more about its whereabouts than he did.

Saruman had spies far over the lands and he eventually found out that the Ring had set out southwards. His spies gave him information which was accurate enough for an attack on the Fellowship at Parth Galen, which almost succeeded.

But that happened much later. Saruman got no useful information from Gandalf while he was imprisoned. He also ignored the plans that were made later in Elrond’s Council. Nor is it suggested anywhere in the book that he already became aware of the Fellowship while they were still West of the Misty Mountains.

Therefore, this sentence _"So, Gandalf, you try to lead them over Caradhras"_ as well as his conjuring the wrath of Caradhras is pure invention from Peter Jackson, and a most regrettable one too (as were all his other “inventions” which distort the story line of the books). The Fellowship’s misfortunes on Caradhras were unrelated to Saruman.


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