# Tolkien and Cats. . .



## HLGStrider (Sep 20, 2003)

OK. . .

I always got the impression that Tolkien didn't like cats. I don't hold this against him (nobody's perfect. ), but it was always my impression that he was a dog sort of person. 

His original Sauron in the Lay of Luthien was Telvido, prince of cats, so there is one cat villian, and then there was that creepy queen with the cats. . .

Ok, I decided, this guy did not like cats!

Then when I was reading through my JRR Tolkien Artist and Illustrator Book I saw a series of sketches he did in his early, married life. They included two cats who it says "used to dance when his wife played the piano." 

So at one point he had cats! . . .or were they his wife's cats. . .hmmm. . .

I couldn't find out anymore.

Did he or didn't he like cats?

I know this is a rather silly thread but I don't want it to be spamming or anything like that, so lets try to be good. I seriously want to know the Tolkien view of Cats.


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## Ancalagon (Sep 20, 2003)

Tolkien does make mention of cats in his work, usually to describe the ability of ones eyes in piercing the dark or for the silence displayed in their hunting technique, though usually he does this when comparing them to the traits and skills of Orcs or Elves.

Of course, the most famous mention of Cats in his works relates to the most mysterious and elusive Cats of Queen Beruthiel, whom we know virtually nothing about, nor are we ever likely to! 

However, regarding whether he actually liked Cats or not, one cannot be clear, though I suspect he was not overly fond of them.


> 219 From a letter to Allen & Unwin 14 October 1959
> [A Cambridge cat breeder had asked if she could register a litter of Siamese kittens under names taken from The Lord of the Rings.]
> My only comment is that of Puck upon mortals. I fear that to me Siamese cats belong to the fauna of Mordor, but you need not tell the cat breeder that. *The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien*


Does this mean Tolkien dislikes Cats, or only a dislike of Siamese?


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## HLGStrider (Sep 22, 2003)

I'd say just on Siameses or he would've said "cats."

Maybe we're never going to know. . .

Siamese cats are evil looking. ..

Oh well, a thread with no answer.


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## jallan (Sep 27, 2003)

He may have had mixed feelings about cats.

Certainly a strong motif in his first version of the story of Beren and Lúthien was the opposition between dog and cat (with the cats on the bad side). 

On the other hand, he writes amusingly and sympathetically of the cats.

But in later versions all of this is removed and instead the opposition is between dog and wolf.

Then there is Tolkien’s poem “The Fat Cat on the Mat” which possibly is not altogether friendly to cats (though that may be reading too much into it) but is certainly appreciative of cats.

I think it one of his best verses.


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## HLGStrider (Sep 27, 2003)

I think it is friendly in that it is basically what a lot of people believe about the common house cat and what the common house cat believes about itself. ..

There isn't anything common about a common house cat.


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## pipin (Mar 5, 2004)

maby he was alergic and thout of them as pain becuse he mihgt have never been ner a cat with out some thing bad hapin.


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## Barliman Butterbur (Mar 5, 2004)

HLGStrider said:


> Did he or didn't he like cats?



Fortunately this question is answered directly by the main protagonists themselves: Queen Beruthiel's cats, who, when asked this very question, said the following:

"Meeeeeoawwwwww!"

Lotho


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## Walter (Mar 6, 2004)

Wasn't Tolkien also the author of this poem (later used as lyrics for a song)?



> Black and orange stray cat sittin' on a fence
> Ain't got enough dough to pay the rent
> I'm flat broke but I don't care
> I strut right by with my tail in the air.
> ...



But then again...maybe it was Brian Setzer...


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## AraCelebEarwen (Jul 19, 2005)

Wether he liked cats or not I have yet to decide. However! I can now tell you that he did have a word for cat, meoi is elvish for our much loved little friends. I find it very fun to use the ideas from JRR and my own overactive (at times) mind in the RPGs and things. And even as I wright this I have a little gray and white kitten playing in my lap! Wonderful soft coat and large brown eyes! *sigh*  I'm happy!


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## Hobbit-GalRosie (Jul 22, 2005)

I'd just like to add for all those who are interested that meoi is, as Ara said, Elvish for cats, but more specifically Quenya. The Sindarin words are Miog or Miaug for a male and Miaulin for a female.

And speaking of Sindarin...Ara, your name would translate as Noble Silver Sea-maiden, correct? Or am I losing my mind today?


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## AraCelebEarwen (Jul 22, 2005)

No, you are exactly correct!  Very good!

Miaulin? Cool! Thanks for the info! I LOVE to get new words to add to my list! Hannon le mellon nin!


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## Shireman D (Jul 22, 2005)

Looking back at BoLT2's account of the defeat of the cats gave me the sense that the story was mythic - it explains two things
a. why cats and dogs get on badly 
b. why cats are aloof

It is almost as though the story could have grown from one of those childlike questions that might have come from someone in the family. As a piece of writing of that sort it works very well and is almost free-standing but it does not move the Luthien-Tinuviel tale on in the same way as the 'normative' text in the Silmarillion.

Quotes:

"Little to Huan's liking was it that Tevildo lived still, but now no longer did he fear the cats, and that tribe has fled before the dogs ever since, and the dogs hold them in scorn since the humbling of Teveildo in the woods nigh Angamandi." BoLT2 p.29

"Afterwards, Melko heard all and he cursed Tevildo and his folk and banished them, nor have they since that day had lord or master or any friend, and their voices wail and screech for their hearts are very lonely and bitter and full of loss." _op cit_ p.30


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## HLGStrider (Jul 23, 2005)

I have never studied Elvish (I'm determined to learn Spanish first), but I have been told that the word in my sig "Meldomeior" means lover of cats. Where the person who gave me that word found that out I have no idea.


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## Thorondor_ (Jul 23, 2005)

> I have been told that the word in my sig "Meldomeior" means lover of cats. Where the person who gave me that word found that out I have no idea.


Neither my friends nor I ever heard of that word in spanish; cat lover would be something like "el que ama los gatos". [Btw, does Meldomeior come from something in particular? I think that cat is translated into elvish as miog/miel and lover as melindo/melisse.]


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## HLGStrider (Jul 24, 2005)

I was saying that the word was Elvish but I didn't know because I was studying Spanish not Elvish. 

I didn't mean that Meldomeior was Spanish.


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