# Amlach's Impersonator?



## Ancalagon (Jun 5, 2002)

Bereg of the House of Beor and Amlach, son of Imlach where chief among those who spoke discord among Men and Elves concerning the threat from Morgoth. Who then spoke these words?



> But there arose one who seemed to all to be Amlach son of Imlach, speaking fell words that shook the hearts of all who heard him: 'All this is but Elvish lore, tales to beguile newcomers that are unwary. The Sea has not shore. There is no Light in the West. You have followed a fool-fire of the elves to the end o the world! Which of you has seen the least of the Gods? Who has beheld the Dark King in the North? Those who seek the dominion of Middle-earth are the Eldar. Greedy for wealth they have delved in the earth for its secrets and have stirred to wrath the things that dwell beneath it, as they have ever done and ever shall. Let the Orcs have the realm that is theirs, and we will have ours. There is room in the world, if the Eldar will let us be!'
> Then those that listened sat for a while astounded, and a shadow of fear fell on their hearts; and they resolved to depart far from the lands of the Eldar. But afterwards Amlach returned among them, and denied that he had been present at their debate or had spoken such words as they reported; and there was doubt and bewilderment among Men.



Was it really an emmissary from Morgoth or was it Amlach himself who denied his words and repented of them after he cooled down?


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## Gothmog (Jun 11, 2002)

I would say that it was an emmissary of Morgoth who spoke these words and not Amlach himself. In the speach it is put as:


> 'All this is but Elvish lore, tales to beguile newcomers that are unwary. The Sea has no shore. There is no Light in the West. *You* have followed a fool-fire of the elves to the end o the world! Which of *You* has seen the least of the Gods? Who has beheld the Dark King in the North?


 I would have expected it to have read *We* or *Us* if it had been Amlach talking. For before this council Amlach and Bëor Spoke in different fashion thus:


> The leaders of discontent were Bereg of the house of Bëor, and Amlach, one of the grandsons of Marach; and they said openly: '*We* took long roads, desiring to escape the perils of Middle-earth and the dark things that dwell there; for *we* heard that there was Light in the West. But now *we* learn that the Light is beyond the Sea. Thither *we* cannot come where the Gods dwell in bliss. Save one; for the Lord of the Dark is here before *us*, and the Eldar, wise but fell, who make endless war upon him. In the North he dwells they say; and there is the pain and death from which *we* fled. *We* will not go that way.'


And after the council:


> But Amlach repented, saying: 'I have now a quarrel of my own with this Master of Lies, which will last to my life's end'; and he went away north and entered the service of Maedhros.


 this seems to be the actions of one who has been wronged not someone who has repented words he spoke in haste. I think that the repentance of Amlach was of the words he spoke before the council was called and that he spoke the truth when he said that he had not been there and had not spoken such words.


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## Ancalagon (Nov 18, 2002)

Then which emmisary of Morgoth? Could it have been Sauron The Sorceror or another?


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## Confusticated (Nov 18, 2002)

I am with Gothmog that this was not Amlach himself. I wasn't aware of the use of the word "we" vs "you" but something reading that gave me the impression that it was not Amlach though I could not put my finger on it.



> Many of the Noldor and the Sindar they took captive and led to Angband, and made them thralls, forcing them to use their skill and their knowledge in the service of Morgoth. *And Morgoth sent out his spies, and they were clad in false forms and deceit was in their speech; they made lying promises of reward, and with cunning words sought to arouse fear and jealousy among the peoples, accusing their kings and chieftains of greed, and treachery one to another.* And because of the curse of the Kinslaying at Alqualondë these lies were often believed; and indeed as the time darkened they had a measure of truth, for the hearts and minds of the Elves of Beleriand became clouded with despair and fear.


While this speaks of the Noldor, I see no reason that spies of Morgoth would not have taken on the form of men to decieve them too.
We know that Morgoth went away east among men for awhile but when he came back west he sent some of his workers to stay out east to decieve men. Now I don't who this false Amlach was. But of the servants known to us I think Sauron is the most likely.
Sauron would have been in comand at Tol Sirion at this time, but we know that he would go out and decieve people with phantoms.
He did this to Gorlim, using a phantom of his wife.


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## Arvedui (Sep 28, 2005)

I tend to believe that it is as Nóm said, most possibly Sauron. Mostly because he is the only other person that I know about that could have such skills at the time.


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## Inderjit S (Sep 28, 2005)

I always had a hunch it was Sauron, just because it was his forte, so to speak, to devise phantoms etc. since he was a sorcerer. It may well have been a lesser servant of Morgoth though, a spy sent out to cause dissension amongst the Edain.


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## Ithrynluin (Sep 29, 2005)

I don't see this impersonator as Sauron at all. I simply think that this was a man who somewhat resembled Amlach in looks and bearing perhaps, and was skeptical as to where their road would take them, and this may have come as a result of Morgoth's whisperings and lies. If this was no mere man, then I think it may have been some sort of lesser servant of Morgoth who had the ability to temporarily change his appearance, or at least to fool the eyes of the meek and foolhardy.


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