# Few Questions.



## KellGreenleaf (Dec 14, 2003)

1. Did Gandalf have parents? I know its kinda silly. But I'm curious.
2. How did Gandalf meet up with the Baggins? 
3.In the movie LotR FotR when Gandalf is about to fall why doesnt anyone try and help him, all they do is stand there and wait for him to fall.
4.In the book FotR when Frodo is at the ford, who like summons those horses to come out of the water to attack the Black Riders?
5. When they are in the Mines Of Moria and the cave troll attacks Frodo when he has the mithril on how come he doesnt die. The force of the attack would of like broken his ribs or done some pretty nasty damage.


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## Talierin (Dec 14, 2003)

1. I don't think he did, since he was sent from Eru (God in Tolkien's books)

2. Read The Hobbit 

3. That's one thing I've always disliked about the movie, him hanging on like that.... In the book the Balrog's whip knocks him off the bridge and he just falls, yelling "Fly, you fools!"

4. Elrond causes the flood, and Gandalf added the horses, if I remember right. None of this Arwen nonsense in the book 

5. Mithril is very, very strong. In the book I believe he does get a nasty bruise, however


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## KellGreenleaf (Dec 14, 2003)

I did read The Hobbit, but I think I forgot.

Oh another thing. In the book it says that the Nazgul are getting information from animals people etc. Like Ferny was giving info to them that they were at The Prancing Pony. But in the movie it says they *sense the ring*, or did I miss something?


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## Talierin (Dec 14, 2003)

Both are true. They can "smell" the ring when it's very close, but they also gather information from "corrupt" people and animals.


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## Bucky (Dec 15, 2003)

I do not believe it is anywhere stated that the Nazgul _smell_ the ring.....

Aragorn says "They smell the blood of all living things"

They SENSE the pressence of the Ring, not smell it.


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## Lantarion (Dec 15, 2003)

Excellent answers Tal; I'll just add my own versions. 

1. No Gandalf was a Maia, and has therefore existed since the beginning of Eä. I'm not quite sure, but I believe that all Ainur were created simultaneously. (But the Istari weren't sent by Eru but by the Valar )

2. In the Third Age, Olórin of the Istari took a great interest in things that the other Wizards didn't; one of them was Hobbits. He marvelled at their lumbering and lazy and yet determined and exceptionally hardy qualities. He had been around the Shire even before he met Bilbo, I'm pretty sure. 
About why Gandalf chose Bilbo specifically, there's this from _Unfinished Tales_:


> "Somehow I had been attracted by Bilbo long before, as a child, and a young hobbit: he had not quite come of age when I had last seen him. He had stayed in my mind ever since, with his eagerness and his bright eyes, and his love of tales, and his questions about the wide world outside the Shire. As soon as I entered the Shire I heard news of him. He was getting talked about, it seemed. Both his parents had died early for Shire-folk, at about eighty; and he had never married. He was already growing a bit queer, they said, and went off for days by himself. He could be seen talking to strangers, even Dwarves.
> "'Even Dwarves!' Suddenly in my mind these three things came together: the great Dragon with his lust, and his keen hearing and scent; the sturdy heavy-booted Dwarves with their old burning grudge; and the quick, soft-footed Hobbit, sick at heart (I guessed) for a sight of the wide world. [...]


From UT, 'The Quest of Erebor'.

3. I agree with Tal, it was dumb that Gandalf just hung around on the rock and then practically let go himself; in the book it all happens a lot faster. There was no time to help him, because he was already falling: he only "grasped vainly" at the rock, he didn't actually grab hold of it.

4. As Tal said, Elrond summoned the waves (because he obviously had some power in his ring Vilya, and otherwise as well) and Gandalf added the horses. It really bugs me that Arwen could just say a couple of words and then up came the leaping waves. 

5. In the book there is no damn 'cave troll'; it's a creation of PJ's. I agree that he would have fared a lot worse, even with the _mithril_ coat on, if a huge hulking pile of muscle like that had jabbed him with a spear.
But in the book it is an 'orc chieftain' I believe, who, though definately very strong, would not have the same strength as any creature like PJ's 'cave troll'. And Tal is right; _mithril_ was probably the strongest metallic element to be found in Arda, except maybe Eöl's own metal called _galvorn_, of which Túrin's sword Gurthang was made.

About the Nazgûl sensing the Ring, I believe that was because of their constant contact and dependance on the Nine which Sauron wore, and their strength and Sauron power over them was also dependant of the stored power in the Ring; they simply senses their own 'heartbeat', so to speak.


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## Bucky (Dec 15, 2003)

>>>>In the book there is no damn 'cave troll'; 

No, but there are trolls & I believe even the term 'cave troll' is used by Tolkien somewhere, isn't it?

BUT, don't EVER take something PJ does in the movie & project it as' canon' for Tolkien as some novices do.


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## Lantarion (Dec 16, 2003)

Tolkien's references are to Olog-hai and Oghor-hai, which were special breeds of Trolls; but I don't thikn they were of the gigantic size that PJ envisions. 


> BUT, don't EVER take something PJ does in the movie & project it as' canon' for Tolkien as some novices do.


Welll of course not; did I say something to indicate that I did?


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## Bucky (Dec 16, 2003)

_ Welll of course not; did I say something to indicate that I did?_

No, I think the original poster asked some questions that did.
And others have from time to time.....

It's exasperating.  


_Tolkien's references are to Olog-hai and Oghor-hai, which were special breeds of Trolls; but I don't thikn they were of the gigantic size that PJ envisions. 
_

I think it actually says 'cave troll' in TLOR somewhere. I'll check it out & report back......

However, trolls WERE as big as PJ shows them.
If you are thinking that the Orc cheiftan who attacks Frodo with the spear in the Chamber Of Mazarbul should not be that big, well, yes, that's correct. But, when you change the Orc to a Troll, it makes sense that it would be huge.


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## Inderjit S (Dec 16, 2003)

> 'There are Orks and very many of them' he said 'and some are large and evil: Black Uruks of Mordor. For the moment they are hanging back, but there is something else there. A great cave troll I think.


 _The Bridge of Khazad-dûm _ 

Frodo then stabbed the Troll who was trying to prise open the door into the chamber of Mazarbul. Gandalf states:



> 'Let us go before the Troll returns!'



Two "great trolls" were seen be Legolas just before the Balrog came.

During the Long Winter (Nov-March, 2758-9) when the Dunlendings, under Wulf, son of Freca, lord of Adorn and aided by the Corsairs of Umbar drove the Rohirrim out of Edoras and their lands, Helm the Rohhirc King used to go on the prowl at night and kill the Dunlendings stalking 'like a Snow Troll.'

The Orc-chieftain who attacked Frodo was nearly man-height. _Disaster of the Gladden Fields_ tells us 'man-height' was about 6"4.


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## Ingolmin (Jan 5, 2017)

1) Yes his parent was Eru Illuvitar. Gandalf was the offspring of his thought.
2)Read The Hobbit.
3)This is because he was caught by the whip of the Balrog. And nobody could help him as Gandalf already told them that he was beyond any of them.
4)Gandalf.
5)You should read The Fellowship of the Ring and you will get the answers to all the questions you have asked here.


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