# Gollum's Age and finding the Ring.



## Omeganian (Aug 20, 2009)

I have noticed an interesting thing. In the appendices to LOTR, It says the Ring was found about 550 years before the War of the Ring. However, in the _Silmarillion_ it says that the Ring was found "ere the kings failed in Gondor" - at least twice as many years ago. At first, one might think it _was_ 550 years ago, _since Silmarillion_ is not supposed to be completely consistent with the other works.

However, if one thinks, it appears that the _Silmarillion_ is consistent with LOTR... and the Appendices are NOT.

Consider. The Gladden fields are rather close to the Mirkwood. The Hobbits are said in the Prologue to have left the area soon after the Shadow settled in Dol Guldur. Considering their dislike of darkness, there is little chance any remained for even a century.

In fact, it seems possible that the Ring revealed itself _because_ it felt its Master growing stronger.

In this case, It seems more likely Gollum is around 2000 years old.

Perhaps Tolkien considered it too much?


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## Illuin (Aug 23, 2009)

> _Originally posted by *Omeganian*
> In this case, It seems more likely Gollum is around 2000 years old._


 The normal lifespan of Hobbits is not much different than that of Men, so the only logical approach is to "guess" at Gollum's age at the time he found the Ring, and add around 550 years to that.


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## Helm (Aug 25, 2009)

Omeganian said:


> The Hobbits are said in the Prologue to have left the area soon after the Shadow settled in Dol Guldur. Considering their dislike of darkness, there is little chance any remained for even a century.


 
Did it say that the ALL the Hobbits left? For some reason I think most of them left but not all.


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## Omeganian (Sep 23, 2009)

Helm said:


> Did it say that the ALL the Hobbits left? For some reason I think most of them left but not all.



Remaining there for fifteen centuries seems like a stretch to me. Hobbits don't like dark.

Besides, look at Gollum talking about Minas Morgul. He heard stories about Minas Ithil, about the kings of Gondor, and doesn't say it was about the past. But it doesn't look like he had any old stories about Minas Morgul, only personal experience. And he says nothing about _how_ it was changed. His lore rich granny would have talked a lot about the change. Unless it was _after_ her.

And also, Gandalf says that Sauron could learn nothing about the Ring "when his power has begun to grow again". It has "begun to grow" around the eleventh century.


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## Bucky (Sep 23, 2009)

His Power had begun to grow'

Simply means that the Ring had passed out of known history & it's owner, Sauron, could find no more about it when he arose in the 3RD Age because little was known - Certainly nothing known outside Imladris or the realm of Gondor, both very unlikely places for Sauron to have much influence or information coming out of in 1050 or 1300 or any time in the 3RD Age.......

It has nothinbg whatsover with Smeagel & Deagle coming upon his prescious and taking it.
.

The questions here are:

1. The Appendices are JRR Tolkien's own work, revised numerous times before publication and therefore 'canon'.

2. The Simarillion is not JRR Tolkien's work per se. They are a coimpilation of JJR TOlkien's works by his son Christopher, done in the manor best needed in _his _opinion at the time to make the story cohesive. It's really taking Tolkien's works line by line & combining multiple Simarillion written sources from his father (it's mind boggling to say the least). As for the essay you mention, Christopher has never mentioned ONE thing concerning it to Tolkien nerds great ire: is it revised or a one time draft? Did Christopher use different sources to 'make 'it himself, or was it penned from one source directly from his father's hand? Etc......

3. What you say does make sense, but in all Silmarillion based variances, see #1.


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## Omeganian (Sep 23, 2009)

Bucky said:


> His Power had begun to grow'
> 
> Simply means that the Ring had passed out of known history & it's owner, Sauron, could find no more about it when he arose in the 3RD Age because little was known - Certainly nothing known outside Imladris or the realm of Gondor, both very unlikely places for Sauron to have much influence or information coming out of in 1050 or 1300 or any time in the 3RD Age.......
> 
> ...



What you say makes sense as well, but I am not using Silmarillion. I am Using LOTR and the prologue, which seem for me to be a higher canon than the appendices. At the very least, it seems Tolkien changed his own mind about Gollum's age at a certain point.

And about Sauron knowing nothing about the ring - I am quoting from the place where Gollum hides in the Misty Mountains. Seems to imply that Sauron started growing in power after that.


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## Alcuin (Sep 24, 2009)

In “Tale of Years”, Appendix B of _Return of the King_, Tolkien makes entries for these years in the Third Age:


2463 The White Council is formed. About this time Déagol the Stoor finds the One Ring, and is murdered by Sméagol.
2470 About this time Sméagol-Gollum hides in the Misty Mountains.
 The War of the Rings arguably began on 20 June 3018, when Mordor attacked Osgiliath and the Nazgûl crossed the River to begin the Hunt for the Ring. That would be 555 years after the finding of the Ring, according to the “Tale of Years”. 

Either Sauron himself or one or more of the Nazgûl settled Amon Lanc (the old name of the hill on which Dol Guldur was built) around the year 1050. Gandalf visited the place in 2063, and “Sauron retreats and hides in the East.” Sauron returned to Dol Guldur in 2460, at which time “his power” arguably began “to grow again”, at least in the West of Middle-earth: the Wise, for all their wisdom, seem to have paid less heed to problems in the East, which were seemingly out of sight and therefore mind.


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## Bucky (Oct 6, 2009)

Oh, by the way.....

Gollum hid in the Misty Mountains because he disliked the light of the sun......,.

And was driven forth from his village by his grandmother because of the strife he caused wearing the Ring.

Gandalf says this clearly to Frodo in 'The Shadow of the Past'.

No conspiracy theory. Sorry.


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