# Did anyone else hate the ending??



## Eithne (May 7, 2002)

Ok, before i go on, I didn't hate the ending past it being too sad for my sappiness to withstand. I thought it was very moving and powerful; and that it showed that everything has good and bad results... with the destruction of the ring came the downfall of the elves and wizards, and Frodo was basically screwed from carrying it. But Middle Earth went on and Sauron was destroyed. I just didn't like that the ones who did the most were forgotten and couldn't enjoy what they had saved. But that's reality (bear with me here, reality in a fantastical sense), so... I dunno. Quote (ah crap, my brother took the book to school! i'll try to remember) "Sometimes what you save, you save for others." or something to that effect. 

So basically, I think it's a beautiful ending, but I got too attatched to the characters to stand it.

Anyone agree? Thoughts?


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## Shadowfax (May 7, 2002)

I thought it was a beutiful anding, but I hated what happend to the characters. I sobbed for three hours after I first read it.


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## Talimon (May 7, 2002)

It's a good ending. Tolkien had an alternate ending, which was an extra chapter where Sam talks to his hobbit children. You can find in one of the "History of the Ring" books by Christopher Tolkien. It was kind of a cheesy ending in my opinion. For one, the hobbit children were all talking in awe of the different members of the fellowship, and while we _do_ get the impression that the Fellowship was held in high accord in later days, it's kind of cheesy to have that sort of praise be included in the book. The last line of the book in the alternate ending was pretty good though. It was something like, "But even as Sam closed the door he heard the everlasting waves on the shores of Middle Earth". It was more elegent in language, but that was the just of it. Not to downplay the current ending (it's extremely powerful as it is), but Tolkien might have been able to include that last line with the current version. That is, instead of having him enter his home and say, "I'm back," have that last line as he reaches home.


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## DGoeij (May 7, 2002)

Actually I liked that last sentence. The whole ending I felt not too happy about it, but it sure was a strong one, IMHO. The sadness made the thing more real. A victor is not by definition a happy ending. Many good things were lost and would not return, even thought the dark Lord was defeated.


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## wonko (May 7, 2002)

i think that the ending was a really good one despite the fact that it was extremely sad... it was sad because everyone either left or died and i really didnt like the fact that the book was over... i guess i'll just have to read the book again..! yay!


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## ROSEY (May 7, 2002)

yeah i both loved and hated the ending for the same reasons i was sad for Frodo but happy for sam,merry aand pip.I think that if it had just ended and not went on to tell about what happened to the fellowship untill they died i would have been tormented wondering what happened next.


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## Goro Shimura (May 7, 2002)

*"I'm Back"*

I think the last bit by Sam emphasizes the "There and Back Again" aspect of the story for Sam-- while the reader is left also with the conspicuous fact that Frodo will never say that....

(This was foreshadowed by Frodo himself when he said something to the effect of "This is no 'there and back again journey'-- but rather a flight from deadly peril into more peril." Sorry if I butcher it.)

It's nice knowing that Sam is happily married with a beautiful child (and on his way to being mayor...) but still... 

Frodo doesn't get to enjoy the Shire anymore.

On the other hand...

Frodo is quite the hero-- didn't he go across the sea with Bilbo, Elrond, and Gandalf?? That's quite a company to be leaving with.

But still...

Frodo's not coming back....

(Bwaaaaa!!  )


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## wonko (May 7, 2002)

those things you mentioned about sam are all happy and stuff but if you read the timeline at the end of the book, he too goes away and never comes back... i think i associate this and most especially legolas/gimli going away as the end of the book and thats why it is so sad ("and here is an end to the fellowship in middle earth" it says or something like it and thats pretty sucky)


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## Sam_Gamgee (May 7, 2002)

I definently got too attached to the carachters and want MORE. boy how i wish there was more. but i love the ending


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## Samwise_hero (May 8, 2002)

i got attached to the characters as well. it was almost like i was in the book and a book that can do that to you is truely awesome. i reckon a sequel the The LOTR would be awesome but there isn't much further they can go. anyways....i reckon it sucked that the real heroes didn't get much credit as well but that's just life.


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## Niniel (May 8, 2002)

I loved the ending! It's very sad of course, but sad things can be beautiful as well. I agree with Goroshimura that it emphasizes the 'There and back again' theme for Sam, but for Frodo he can never get back to the Shire that he knew, because for him it is not the same. It shows that everything you go through in life changes you, and that you grow by it, I think. I have read it a lot of times, but it still touches me when I read it, and I think that proves it's a really great book.


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## ROSEY (May 8, 2002)

amen praise the book although the film is not to bad either but i wouldnt have left out so much and that arwen part is another story!the part that i couldnt get over apart from frodo and sam going off and everyone dying was that legolas would be all alone,imagine all your friends dying and you were left.sob sob


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## Lantarion (May 8, 2002)

It's a good ending IMO, but it is a bit sad and I get the feeling of injustice when I think of the ignorance of most of the saved inhabitants of Middlle-Earth, who don't even know who saved them from what!


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## Legolam (May 8, 2002)

I know what you mean Ponti! Merry and Pip were given much more respect back in the Shire, just because Frodo didn't get involved in the Scouring of the Shire as much.

I didn't like the ending the first time I read the book, because it was sort of a let down after the rest. But when i read it now, it's so sad and sort of fitting that there isn't a real "happy ending". Many beautiful and good things go out of the world at the end of the Third Age, and the ending seems to fit this perfectly.

I didn't realise that there was an alternative ending that Tolkien wrote. But I'm glad he left it as the line "I'm back". Very sad point


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## Goro Shimura (May 8, 2002)

Yeah but after that scene with Aragorn-- "Praise them with great praise!!"-- who cares what the hobbits in the Shire think!!


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## ReadWryt (May 8, 2002)

Tolkien always regretted that he didn't publish the last chapter of the book, and feels that he should not have listened to the folks who told him that it was not necessary. Anyone capable should hunt down a copy of "Sauron Defeated" from the History of Middle-earth and read it. There are a couple of drafts of it, and it has a lovely conversation between Sam and Elenore about Aragorn and where Frodo went and several other questions.


Tolkien also regretted not publishing it because it held the best glimpse of the nature of Hobbit Children.


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## Xanaphia (May 8, 2002)

I LOVED the way the book ended!!! I was pretty sad, but mostly just because it was over and that was hard to deal with. Sure it didn't have a "and they all lived hapilly ever after." ending, but that was kind of refreshing. The book was (when you take out all the mystical middle earth stuff) somewhat realistic, in a sence of how the charactors acted. Frodo and Bilbo had done a lot and wouldn't have been realistic if they had done all that and tehn lived happily ever after. Tolkien was a GENIUS!!!


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## Greenwood (May 8, 2002)

Yes, it is a very sad ending. I have read LOTR more times than I can remember since the early 1960's and I still get teary-eyed when I get to the end. It is however, a great ending, and as I said on an earlier thread when this subject came up before, the ending is one of the things that raises LOTR above the level of the average fantasy book and moves it into the realm of literature. On of the fascinating things about reading the HoME series is seeing the evolution of LOTR from a straight-forward fantasy adventure into something much greater. Often Tolkien's first drafts were closer to a standard fantasy and everything is black-and-white and the heros are all totally good, etc, etc. It is in the rewrites that you see the story change and take on more subtlety and power. Boromir becomes a tortured good guy falling prey to the lure of the Ring, not just a bad guy trying to get the Ring for himself, etc. In the earlier versions of The Scouring of the Shire, Frodo takes a very active role engaging in sword fights with villains, etc. In short, a typical action hero, quite different from the deeper, more complex character he is in the final version. Tolkien's message in the end is far deeper and more complex than a simple "everyone lived happily ever after". It is that though good may triumph in the end if good people fight hard enough for it, there is still a cost to evil. Some will pay a very high price to defeat evil so that others may live in peace. In the end LOTR is not just a typical action adventure, but is about good and evil and the sacrifices that sometimes have to be made.


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## Talimon (May 8, 2002)

> _Originally posted by ReadWryt _
> *Tolkien always regretted that he didn't publish the last chapter of the book, and feels that he should not have listened to the folks who told him that it was not necessary. Anyone capable should hunt down a copy of "Sauron Defeated" from the History of Middle-earth and read it. There are a couple of drafts of it, and it has a lovely conversation between Sam and Elenore about Aragorn and where Frodo went and several other questions.
> 
> 
> Tolkien also regretted not publishing it because it held the best glimpse of the nature of Hobbit Children. *



I liked the alternate ending, but it lacked the emotional intensity of the published one. The alternate ending just seems to make the whole tale a little less epic. The Lord of the Rings, as a book, ends with "I'm back." Sam lives on after that, but it's no longer cruicial to the tale. Besides, ending the book as it ends now reenforces one of the main themes of the book: _What it is to give_. By Frodo and Gandalf leaving Middle Earth, Tolkien drove home the point that some things must be done for more then just personal gain, that there is such a thing as "the greater good."


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## DGoeij (May 8, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Talimon _
> *
> 
> I liked the alternate ending, but it lacked the emotional intensity of the published one. The alternate ending just seems to make the whole tale a little less epic. The Lord of the Rings, as a book, ends with "I'm back." Sam lives on after that, but it's no longer cruicial to the tale. Besides, ending the book as it ends now reenforces one of the main themes of the book: What it is to give. By Frodo and Gandalf leaving Middle Earth, Tolkien drove home the point that some things must be done for more then just personal gain, that there is such a thing as "the greater good." *



Yes, and also that achieving that may be by great costs and sacrifices. That is what struck me as both very sad and very very true.
IMHO, Frodo acting sad and wounded is more 'real' than a Frodo decapitating villans and acting as a war-leader.


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## Shadowfax (May 8, 2002)

tru dat, tru dat. What I really mean, is I loved the ending, but I "hated" it for the character's sakes. I mean, it would really suck @$$ to save the world, come home, find it ruined, fix it, and have no one care.


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## Oren (May 8, 2002)

*No*

I thought that the ending was vey sad, but I loved it! I would probably have liked it even more if it hadn't bben so sad. But at least it wasn't like the other books that come out with all of the characters all coming out with a happy ending! God, that would've been annoying!


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## Ice Man (May 8, 2002)

I fought hard to not cry after I 1st finished reading it, and I wasn't a kid, I was 20 years old.

I was glad, because good had prevailed, but sad because a great adventure had come to an end.

I was glad, because such different characters as Legolas and Gimli becaime friends, but sad because they were leaving me, or was I leaving them?

I was glad because the enemy was defeated, but sad because the good elves were leaving Middle Earth.

I was glad and sad for many things, and sad for some other things, and it really made me think for some days. And I eventually came to a conclusion, which at 1st may look quite simplistic and silly, no matter how fantastic and impossible Middle Earth was/is, it was/is just like our Earth, where good and bad things happen all the time, and we have to deal with them, always trying to find happiness for us and for everyone else.

Hope I don't make a fool out of myself, but this is really how I was feeling once I finished reading LOTR.


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## Shadowfax (May 8, 2002)

I totally get what you're saying. It is a tear jerker because it is a mix of absolute joy and despair. And I probably would have liked it less if it had been all happy at the end.


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## Eithne (May 8, 2002)

i loved it too.... i'm just saying that i hated it for the characters.... it seemed so unjustified if u know what i mean....

but i did think it was moving and beautiful and i wouldn't have it ne other way! just lettin ya know.... i didn't HATE it exactly... just i dunno! hard to explain how i felt about it.


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## Shadowfax (May 9, 2002)

I think that's why it's such a powerful book.


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## Tyaronumen (May 9, 2002)

The end of the Lord of the Rings is definitely one of the saddest things I've ever read... but it really has helped me to understand that sorrow is a part of joy, and that regardless of the problems I face in my life, "I must be happy and whole for many years" (to paraphrase Frodo's mini-speech to Sam at the end... )... 

I also recall that it was when reading the end of this book for the very first time that I realized that Frodo and Bilbo would not live forever in the "Undying West" and was really quite upset. It was only later that I realized (as silly as it may sound!) that this was so upsetting to me at the time because prior to that, I had no *real* concept of my own mortality (other than the standard "we'll all die someday" that doesn't really seem to hit home)...


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## Pippin/Frodo (May 14, 2002)

I loved it and hated it. It was sooooo sad. I'm one of those people who friendship means the world to them so when you have these best friends that are together through the whole book and then break them apart that makes me sad.
I have this friend who is my Sam/Merry so it was especially sad when I put myself in the character's place. 
Infact it made me so sad that it was over and their was happines with Sam's baby and sadness cause Frodo left I wrote my own contiuing story. It's on the tolkien forum.


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## DRavisher (May 15, 2002)

I found the ending quite good. But I found it sad that Gandalf, Elrond, Galadriel, Frodo, and all the others left middle-earth:-(


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## Triciawen (May 15, 2002)

I hated the ending. I mean, I read 1000+ pages of their lives, and I don't even know what happens afterwards! What's Valinor like, what do they do there, what happens to Aragorn's kingdom and marriage, what Legolas and Gimli do until they go to Valinor too, etc.

I wanted to scream after the ending.

~Triciawen


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## Pippin/Frodo (May 15, 2002)

That's why I made up what happened next. I felt the same way but I don't anymore cause I'm finding out what does happen.


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## shadowfax_g (May 17, 2002)

I think it is the great ending because I wanted to start all over again as soon as I had finished.


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## Gandalf_White (May 18, 2002)

I HATED the ending. It just didn't end the way I thought it would. But I don't have any other ideas of what the ending could have been like.


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## Wonko The Sane (May 21, 2002)

It hurt me that Frodo didn't get any recognition and that the world was ruined for him...
I love that little guy...

I wish Elijah would marry me.


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## jonathan (May 21, 2002)

i've just finished reading "return of the king". can anyone tell me WHY they all had to leave at the end? i've read this whole thread and a couple others and i can't find where anyone talked about it.

sorry if i missed the correct thread.


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## Eithne (May 21, 2002)

well... it said that they left b/c they "were no longer needed" in ME, whatever that means. i think they had done everything they could for ME and couldn't stay w/o seeing everything and just being... well, depressed, b/c their time had passed.  

and, wts, i wish elijah would marry me too *profuse sigh* hence my location... lmao


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## Wonko The Sane (May 22, 2002)

That's why the elves and Gandalf had to leave.

But Bilbo and Frodo left because they were ring-bearers...and sometimes when you save things you save them for others.
They couldn't enjoy the world.
It held no joy for them anymore.
It was all hollow.

The only place they could find solace were the undying lands.


and Eithne, you can't have him...I believe he's mine.  *profuse sigh as well* *swoons* he's so beautiful...


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## LotR_Girl (May 22, 2002)

Couldn't stop cryin... *sniiiiffffff*
I hate there's no more info on Legolas & Gimli...I really loved Legolas in book, but that Orlando spoiled the whole thing!


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## Merry (May 23, 2002)

I felt empty the first time I finished LOTR, I was quite distressed that Frodo held no fame and that his enormous achievements were forgotten by his own people, if not in lore and songs.

I felt so sad for Sam because he had lost his master and was left to deal with the world alone.

Then I re-read LOTR and I loved the ending!

Frodo had fame beyond his wildest dreams in Gondor and Rohan and he would have been celebrated by many, maybe even in the undying lands.

Frodo left the world to be in a better place because middle-earth could not heal his wounds, it would have been more tragic for him to stay.

Sam gets married and has a family and becomes Mayor, his life continues and gets better.

You have to look beyond Sams initial sadness and look at it as the start of a new, peaceful age under the returned king.


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## Wonko The Sane (May 23, 2002)

I love the ending.


It made me full of happinesses.

But how can you say Orlando Bloom ruined Legolas?!

He's too beautiful to ruin anything!!


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## Diabless (May 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by shadowfax_g _
> *I think it is the great ending because I wanted to start all over again as soon as I had finished. *



Dude! Shadowfax! That's EXACTLY how I felt! And I read it again (I am 15). It's not that I wanted to re-experience it. I HAD to for my own well being. I could not live in ME for one monthy and then leave. It was too drastic a change. The only thing that stopped me from reading it a third time is I was excited about reading the Sil. I have now read 260 pages of the Sil.

And I wanna go back to the Third Age and see my friends Frodo and Sam and I WILL. But maybe next time I'll read it in French or Spanish so that I am practicing my language skills.

The point is:
I love LOTR and I will never be able to leave ME while I still have problems to escape which I will always have. Therefore, I will keep going back to the book. And I will look FORWARD to crying at the end because I like experiencing emotion. Oh and btw, at ROTK in theaters, don't sit next to me because I will bawl my eyes out.


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## Theoden (May 24, 2002)

it was bittersweet... I felt like tolkien was trying to say that no matter how great the victory is, there is always a price to be paid. And poor Frodo had to pay it. Bur if that price had not been paid... well tolkien wouldn't have had so many fans. but let's face it, the ending was excellent.


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## Wonko The Sane (May 24, 2002)

Ditto...
I heart Tolkien...


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## Eithne (May 27, 2002)

so true... i love the ending too; i was just sad for the characters, since even though they left for the undying lands they'll never be fully and truly happy. but hey, i wouldn't have it any other way and i think it ultimately complimented the book and made it all the more moving.


and wonko the sane... back away from my man...


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