# The kinds of dragons and their mental powers



## Saermegil (Nov 17, 2003)

I would like to know more about dragons and particularly about:
a)How many kinds of dragons were there? What are each kind's properties?

Could you go further into the qualities of each dragon and explain to me: 
b)What mental powers did each kind of dragon possess?


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## Gwindor (Nov 20, 2003)

Tolkien distinguished flying (winged) from non-flying and cold from fire dragons.
I don't know much about their mental powers. Glaurung could hold Turin's concentration, Smaug seemed to get into Biblo's mind ...


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## Lantarion (Nov 20, 2003)

Tolkien, although creating many concepts extremely common and even cliché in modern fantasy literature, did not emphasize the importance of dragons (or _Urulóki_) in his mythos.
It is not even certain how they came to be in Arda, except that Melkor bred them. (I can't find the quote I'm looking for right now, sorry.)
But Gwindor is right, Toklien distinguishes between winged and non-winged dragons. Below I will list all the dragons that are mentioned in Tolkien works (i.e. in the LotR, the Hobbit and the Silmarillion; and Unfinished Tales).

Glaurung: The Father of Dragons, the first dragon spawned by Melkor. He was not winged but was immensely large, and crawled along the ground; he was given the nickname 'Worm of Morgoth', probably by Túrin. He had the ability to paralyze, erase the memories of, hypnotize and speak with Men and Elves, and also to breathe fire. He was wounded by Azaghâl, and killed by Túrin Turambar, who is nicknamed 'Dagnir Glaurunga', the 'Bane of Glaurung'.

Ancalagon: Not a lot is said about this dragon, except that he was the "greatest of the winged dragons of Morgoth": he was slain by Eärendil in the War of Wrath, and when he fell from the sky his body smote the Thangorodrim and basically flattened them. 

Smaug: Nothing is known abuot him except what is given in the Hobbit, and in Unfinished Tales. Apparently he was the last dragon in existence, and therefore very, very old; but age does not touch dragons like it does Men. In UT, Toklien writes that the main reason for recovering the gold of the Dwarves from Erebor was not only to reclaim their ancient home but to kill the last dragon somehow, so that Sauron would not get his hands on it. 
Smaug had the power of telepathy (as did Glaurung), breathing fire, and he was winged and could fly. He was also extremely sly, and likie Glaurung his eyes had a sort of brainwashing talent. But he had a gold-and-trinket fetish.  

Those are the main three dragons, I don't think any other arementioned by name.
But both Ancalagon and Smaug were of the 'offspring' of Glaurung, and Glaurung had extremely many dragons behind him, as is seen in the Battle of Unnumbered Tears and the Siege of Gondolin.

Hope that helped!


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## Celebthôl (Nov 20, 2003)

You're forgetting Scatha old boy


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## Deleted member 3778 (Nov 20, 2003)

All he did was cause alot of trouble, get killed and have his teeth used as jewelry..


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## Lantarion (Nov 20, 2003)

Ack! 
I must slay myself for my incompetence! *falls on Glamdring*


Ahem, yes.
Well I'm not feeling particularily active right now, so here's my awful, underhanded copy-paste from the EoA! 



> One of the greatest of the dragons to infest the Grey Mountains of the north. Of his life little is known, except that he was slain by Fram son of Frumgar (an ancestor of Eorl the Young) in the early days of the Éothéod.
> 
> His recovered hoard was the subject of great dispute between the Men of the Éothéod and the Dwarves of that region, who claimed the hoard as their own. Fram rebuked their claim, and sent them the teeth of the dragon, with the words, "_Jewels such as these you will not match in your treasuries, for they are hard to come by_." Thereafter there was war between the Éothéod and the Dwarves, a war in which Fram met his end.
> 
> However this dispute was resolved (we are not told), it seems that Fram's people retained at least some of the hoard, and brought it south with them when they settled in Rohan. The horn that Éowyn gave to Merry Brandybuck after the War of the Ring (many hundred years later) was said to have come from it.


Ahh I love that phrase! "Jewels such as these you will not match in your treasuries, for they are hard to come by." OUCH take that Dwarvies, BUUUURN.


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## Melko Belcha (Nov 20, 2003)

There are Cold-drakes, which are non-fire breathing dragons.

Fire-drakes are the fire breathing dragons.

Urulóki is also a name for fire-drakes, but I believe that Urulóki refers to the older fire breathing dragons which Smaug was the last of.

Tolkien also mentions Long-worms, but he never mentions Short-worms, so Long-worms may just be a name for all dragons or for a certain divison of dragons.


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## Maegnas (Nov 20, 2003)

*Smaug*

Could some one tell me how smaug was the last Dragon alive?


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## Celebthôl (Nov 20, 2003)

Well there were (suposibly) no other dragons after him. When he died so did his kind. . .


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## Maegnas (Nov 20, 2003)

*Smaug*

How did they all die out.


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## Lantarion (Nov 20, 2003)

A terrible pestilence, an awful disease... many calle it SPECULATION! 
Ahem but unless it is stated in HoME, I don't think Toklien clearly outlines how they all died. They were probably hunted, but other than that I have no idea.


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## Maegnas (Nov 20, 2003)

*Thanks*

Thank you for helpeing me with the dragons i have been dying to know.


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## Melko Belcha (Nov 21, 2003)

In LotR when Gandalf is talking to Frodo about the Ring, Gandalf says there are no dragons left with the old fire. So I take that as meaning there are still dragons, but Smaug was the last with the old fire.


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## Saermegil (Nov 21, 2003)

*Thanks a lot!*

Thanks a lot everybody! You have been very helpful. I really wanted to know more about dragons.


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## Mithlond (Nov 22, 2003)

I think Smaug was only the last of the fire-breathing dragons. 
I vaguely seem to recall reading in UT of cold-drakes still existing past Smaugs time up in the Withered Heath.


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## Lantarion (Nov 22, 2003)

Hearth... 
Ah yes I forgot the Withered Hearth, and Forodwaith.. But where does Tolkien actually speak about these 'cold-dragons'?


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## Bucky (Nov 23, 2003)

_Could some one tell me how smaug was the last Dragon alive?_

Well, I'm not so sure that's the case........

We are tearing apart the living room - new carpet, furniture, etc, so my books aren't handy. I'll do this from memory......

I read here or in HoME #11 that 2 dragons survived THe War of Wrath.

Then, you hear NOTHING until well into the 3rd Age.

Then, 'Dragons begin to reappear in The Withered Heath' in 'The Tale Of the Years' around 2000 to 2400 TA.

Smaug, 'greatest of the dragons of that age, descends upon Erebor'......

Then, you have Gandalf's statement that "There isn't a dragon left.... in whom the old fire is hot enough"......

My conclusion, based on Gandalf's comment & the VERY long space between The War of Wrath & the reappearing of dragons in the TA, is that dragons go through long periods of 'dormancy' or whatever, their eggs can take 2000 years to hatch at times...
I don't know, but they can disappear for long periods & reappear when you think they've been extinct.


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## Red Istar (Nov 23, 2003)

Oh my gosh... this entire time I have been totally unaware some dragons had wings and others did not! Where the heck did I put my brain?! 

I must slay myself for my incompetence! *falls upon Glamdring*


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## Lantarion (Nov 24, 2003)

> I must slay myself for my incompetence! *falls upon Glamdring*


*Laughs for several minutes until his eyes water*


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## Red Istar (Nov 24, 2003)

I'm glad you find my pitiful ignorance so amusing.


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## WizardMagus (Dec 15, 2003)

Didn't all of the seven Dwarven fortunes (accumulated thanks to Sauron's seven rings) have a dragon attack and take them? I could have sworn that was the case. If so, I couldn't see Smuag doing that all alone! Certainly he had help.

And Gandalf didn't say that Smuag was the LAST dragon, just the last one with fires hot enough to melt a ring (I'm pretty sure that's the context it was used in). I think Tolkien was implying that dragons still existed, but like everything else, their modern versions were far weaker than the original ones.


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## Bucky (Dec 15, 2003)

Well, Magus, I believe Gandalf says that of the Seven Rings, "Three he (Sauron) has recovered & the others the Dragons have consumed."

As for the 7 Dwarf fortunes, meaning 7 Mansions, let's see....

Nogrod - Destroyed in The War Of Wrath
Belegost - Destroyed in The War Of Wrath
Moria - Deserted after Durin's Bane was released
Erebor - Sacked by Smaug

So, I'd say, no, that's not the case as far as we know.


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## Zale (Jan 10, 2004)

As to how the dragons died out, I would imagine powerful warriors hunted them down and killed them, either for their hoard of treasure, or because they were pestering the locals.
I can't remember any mention of "cold dragons". Is this just in HoME?


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## Captain (Jan 10, 2004)

In The Shadow of the past, Gandalf says:


> "but there is not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough...."


By the context this means that there are still dragons left; they did not all die out.


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## jallan (Jan 10, 2004)

Celebthôl said:


> Well there were (suposibly) no other dragons after him. When he died so did his kind. . .


Not so.

From letter 144:


> Some stray answers. _Dragons_. They had not stopped; since they were active in far later times, close to our own. Have I said anything to suggest the final ending of dragons? If so it should be altered. The only passage I can think of is Vol. I p. 70: ‘there is not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough’. But that implies, I think, that there are still dragons, if not of full primeval stature.


In the phrase “active in far later times, close to our own,” Tolkien is here speaking of the dragons who appear in various legends such as _Beowulf_ or _St. George and the Dragon_ (and even in Tolkien’s own _Farmer Giles of Ham_).

Similarly dwarfs and various fairy folk and little people and monsters such as trolls and ogres and giants as found in legends are to be imagined as survivals of the dwarves, elves, hobbits, trolls and stone-giants of the Third Age of Middle-earth, though the elves would be much faded and dwindled by the times of which our legends speak.

There appears to have been an increase in the number of dragons towards the end of the Third Age followed by their destruction.

From Appendix A III:


> But there were dragons in the wastes beyond; and after many years they became strong again and multiplied, and they made war on the Dwarves, and plundered their works. At last Dáin I, together with Frór his second son, was slain at the door of his hall by a great cold-drake.


This is later dated to the year 2589 of the Third Age.

But apparently by the time of _The Hobbit_ only Smaug remained to trouble the north-west of Middle-earth. Presumably the others were slain or driven far away. Smaug at the time he descended on the Lonely Mountain is described as ‘greatest of the dragons of his day’ which partly explains why Smaug was the last to fall.


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## Belegmacar (Jan 28, 2004)

Are "cold-drakes" merely dragons that do not spray fire or do they spray some other substance?


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