# What did cause Frodo to cave in the end and claim the Ring?



## BalrogRingDestroyer (Mar 3, 2020)

I'm just curious what the Ring could have lured him with to make him cave when he was so close to destroying it. It wasn't like Boromir where he thought that most likely it would fall into Sauron's hands by taking it to Mordor and that all of the blood spilt by his fellows in Gondor would be for naught and his thought that using it could save Gondor.

Even if Frodo couldn't bring himself to throw it into the fire, why did he put it on his finger and claim it, actually thinking he could be the master of it?


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## Deleted member 12094 (Mar 4, 2020)

I think you raised an interesting matter, BalrogRingDestroyer: what could the Ring have lured Frodo with?

There are quite a few indications how the Ring exerted influence on its bearers: it worked by seduction indeed, meaning that the Ring can see its bearer’s darker wishes and to exploit those then with views of ultimate satisfaction. Domination was Sauron’s trademark, destruction Morgoth’s.

As regards seduction, some examples that endorse your point:

1. Boromir (you mentioned it), who wanted to rule Gondor:​
_[…] his talk dwelt on walls and weapons, and the mustering of men; and he drew plans for great alliances and glorious victories to be; and he cast down Mordor, and became himself a mighty king, benevolent and wise._​
2. Sam, the gardener:​
_Wild fantasies arose in his mind; and he saw Samwise the Strong, Hero of the Age, striding with a flaming sword across the darkened land, and armies flocking to his call as he marched to the overthrow of Barad-dûr. And then all the clouds rolled away, and the white sun shone, and at his command the vale of Gorgoroth became a garden of flowers and trees and brought forth fruit. He had only to put on the Ring and claim it for his own, and all this could be._​
3. Galadriel, who wanted a kingdom of her own for so long:​
_‘And now at last it comes. You will give me the Ring freely! In place of the Dark Lord you will set up a Queen. And I shall not be dark, but beautiful and terrible as the Morning and the Night! Fair as the Sea and the Sun and the Snow upon the Mountain! Dreadful as the Storm and the Lightning! Stronger than the foundations of the earth. All shall love me and despair!’_​
4. Saruman, with his will for dominance:​
Euh … too many quotes to list here; I’ll abbreviate now, just by confirming he long worked towards his own acquiring the Ring, for dominance.​
I understand your question therefore as to what could similarly have “seduced” Frodo to claim the Ring for his own.

The extent of the Ring’s power on the bearer was race-dependent. Hobbits were particularly hard to “crack” (even Gollum had not lost all his mind according to Gandalf) but the effect became far stronger as Mount Doom drew nearer so Frodo must have resisted far more dominating power than Bilbo did, by the time he gave up.

IMHO Frodo was beaten by the will of the Ring not to destroy it. Whichever “heaven” the Ring proposed to him is not told in LotR, but its will had filled up his mind dominantly. He could no longer control a decision whether to destroy it or not and therefore seduction played no further role in it.

I remember some discussions about a scenario when the Nazgûl had arrived with Frodo wearing the Ring he had just claimed. JRRT commented it in one of his letters, if I remember well. It would not have ended well, of course, but I’d have to find it back when I have more time.


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## Erestor Arcamen (Mar 4, 2020)

Here's the quote from letter 273. I'm copying from a digital copy of the book on my phone so ease excuse the poor formatting 😁.



> The situation as between Frodo with the Ring and the Eight might be compared to that of a
> small brave man armed with a devastating weapon, faced by eight savage warriors of great strength
> and agility armed with poisoned blades. The man's weakness was that he did not know how to use
> his weapon yet; and he was by temperament and training averse to violence. Their weakness that
> ...


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## Deleted member 12094 (Mar 4, 2020)

Thanks for completing this, Erestor Arcamen; that was indeed the quote I was thinking of.


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## Olorgando (Mar 4, 2020)

BalrogRingDestroyer said:


> ...
> Even if Frodo couldn't bring himself to throw it into the fire, why did he put it on his finger and claim it, actually thinking he could be the master of it?


The question of the One Ring having a "mind of its own", being somehow sentient, has been argued by writers far more competent than I am (among them Tom Shippey).
I would think yes, at the very least in a primitive sense of "self-preservation".
At the Cracks of Doom, the very center of Sauron's power as far as the One Ring was concerned and the place of its creation, the One Ring would have "felt" the greatest threat to its continued existence - it was at the one place in Middle-earth where it could be destroyed. Consider Sauron's "whiplash" of attention from "everything else" (including the pitifully small force led to the Black Gate at the entrance to Mordor by Gandalf, Aragorn etc.). The One Ring would have focused its entire however-to-be-defined power towards not being destroyed. Perhaps the reason why Isildur, at the cusp of the change from the Second to the Third Age, also was unable to destroy it exactly at the Cracks of Doom..

Now there were three far more powerful beings in Middle-earth that in the course of LoTR Frodo offered the One Ring to, Gandalf and Galadriel explicitly, and Elrond at least implicitly. Which of the three, somehow being able to appear at the Cracks of Doom by whatever means, would have been able to relieve Frodo of the for him impossible task of actually destroying the One Ring?

Awks. I just noticed that by this time in the Third Age, these three are precisely the bearers of the three Even Rings ...

My vote would go, by perhaps a slender margin, to Galadriel. In term of Middle-earth existence, she was the oldest and most experienced. Having been born in the First Age of the Two Trees probably tens of millennia before the First Age's brief part of the Moon and the Sun. Elrond was "only" born in Middle-earth 58 year before the end of the First Age. Gandalf, though being a Maia, "only" experienced M-e for about 2000 year of the Third Age. But I would not find it hypothetically impossible for even these three to be unable to destroy the One Ring by throwing it into those Cracks.


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## Aramarien (Mar 4, 2020)

BalrogRingDestroyer, it is a good question. Gollum and even Bilbo possessed the Ring, or were possessed by the Ring and BOTH called it their precious. Bilbo was the only one in the history of the Ring to voluntarily give up the Ring with all of Gandalf's help. 

I have always felt CHOICE was an important theme in LOTR. Frodo CHOSE to claim the Ring. 
"I have come,' he said. "But* I do not choose* now to do what I came to do. I will not do this deed. The Ring is mine!!" [ROTK , Mount Doom]

Why did he choose finally? Of course Tolkien has said that NO mortal would be able to resist the Ring at the height of its power at the Cracks of Doom. What did the Ring offer Frodo? 


Olorgando said:


> The question of the One Ring having a "mind of its own", being somehow sentient, has been argued by writers far more competent than I am (among them Tom Shippey).
> I would think yes, at the very least in a primitive sense of "self-preservation".


The sentience of the Ring has been argued in many places in books and forums on the internet. I'm not sure how "sentient" the Ring was, but I do like the idea Olorgando proposes of a primitive sense of "self-preservation". The Ring may have worn Frodo down with ideas of destroying Sauron and having peace and prosperity. Or even his deepest wish: to save the Shire and to see Bilbo again and retire peacefully. Not so much for power. Gandalf had said the way of the Ring to his heart would be through pity: "pity for weakness and the desire of strength to do good" [FOTR; The Shadow of the Past] At the very end, at the Cracks of Doom, the Ring, out of self-preservation may have put out all Its power, the last push of a long marathon It was having with Frodo's will to stop him from destroying It. 

Interesting question about which of the three bearers of the Elven Rings could/ would destroy it. If they showed up at the Cracks of Doom without carrying it for so long and just grab it and throw it in. Even Sam would probably be able to do that. But carrying it closer and closer to Mordor and Mt Doom for months? I don't think that any of them could have resisted. Ironically because they were inherently powerful themselves and would give in to the temptation that they were strong enough to overpower the Ring and use it for good.


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## Phantom718 (Mar 5, 2020)

Olorgando said:


> The question of the One Ring having a "mind of its own", being somehow sentient, has been argued by writers far more competent than I am (among them Tom Shippey).
> I would think yes, at the very least in a primitive sense of "self-preservation".
> At the Cracks of Doom, the very center of Sauron's power as far as the One Ring was concerned and the place of its creation, the One Ring would have "felt" the greatest threat to its continued existence - it was at the one place in Middle-earth where it could be destroyed. Consider Sauron's "whiplash" of attention from "everything else" (including the pitifully small force led to the Black Gate at the entrance to Mordor by Gandalf, Aragorn etc.). The One Ring would have focused its entire however-to-be-defined power towards not being destroyed. Perhaps the reason why Isildur, at the cusp of the change from the Second to the Third Age, also was unable to destroy it exactly at the Cracks of Doom..



I was thinking something very similar. I've always believed the Ring had some sentience, and it grew stronger the closer it got to it's birthplace. Note how the Ring was handled more lightly and casually in the Shire, but it became much more heavy and sinister the closer Frodo brought it to Mordor. Thus, when the Ring was literally on the precipice in Mt. Doom, it had one final power play to consume the ringbearer and survive. It's ironic that the one place it could be destroyed was also the place where it was the strongest.

This then, begs another question: Is the Ring's power reduced the further away it is from Mordor?

It's accepted that the Valar would not take the Ring, so bringing it to Valinor was probably out of the question. But let's suppose they did, and so the Ring is about as far away from Mordor as it could get, would it's power be sapped enough to be controlled and safe? I'm guessing no...that as long as the slightest sliver of the Ring's presence is "alive," the danger of it corrupting it's carrier and thus being led back into Sauron's hands were always a possibility.

Interesting to think about nonetheless.


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## Olorgando (Mar 5, 2020)

Phantom718 said:


> ...
> This then, begs another question: Is the Ring's power reduced the further away it is from Mordor?


It might appear so. The same seems to hold for the Nazgûl, who certainly seem, west of the Misty Mountains, far less effective that what Boromir reports about their (especially the Witch-king's) effect when Sauron's forces took Osgiliath. But this is, from external evidence, iffy territory. Book One in "Fellowship" still bears the mark of being a "New Hobbit" to some degree. JRRT did not revise it entirely to come into line atmospherically with the later parts of LoTR (which I, truth be told, find to be one of its strengths - none of this A to Z hyperventilation that seems to be thought necessary in so many thriller or the like movies; the "Alien" quadrilogy with Sigourney Weaver, especially the first one, does not have the "monster" rampaging onscreen all the time. Suspense works otherwise (or used to work so; maybe parts of the younger generation need to be hit over the head with the thrill bat 24/7 …  ))


Phantom718 said:


> It's accepted that the Valar would not take the Ring, so bringing it to Valinor was probably out of the question. But let's suppose they did, and so the Ring is about as far away from Mordor as it could get, would it's power be sapped enough to be controlled and safe? I'm guessing no...that as long as the slightest sliver of the Ring's presence is "alive," the danger of it corrupting it's carrier and thus being led back into Sauron's hands were always a possibility.


This leads me to one of my "favorite hobbies" about Arda: Valar-bashing. Especially in several parts of HoMe, I thought "why did Eru allow this bunch of indolent wimps to enter Arda, especially as their opponent was that nihilistic psychopath Melkor?!? And the _über_-wimp is Manwë!!!!!"
From chapter II "The Council of Elrond" in Book Two of "Fellowship" (this is Elrond speaking): 'And those wo dwell beyond the sea would not receive it: for good or ill it belongs to Middle-earth; it is for us who still dwell here to deal with it.'

That's *RICH*! "It's not _*our*_ fault!" That's a Himalaya's worth of Baloney Slices!

The Sil, "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age", right at the beginning:
"When Thangorodrim was broken and Morgoth overthrown, Sauron put on his fair hue again and did obeisance to Eönwë, the herald of Manwë, and abjured all his evil deeds. …. But it was not within the power of Eonwë to *pardon* those of his own order, and he *commanded* Sauron to return to Aman and there receive the judgement of Manwë. Then Sauron was ashamed, and he was unwilling to return in humiliation and receive from the Valar a sentence .... Therefore when Eonwë departed he hid himself in Middle-earth …."

What's wrong with this pathetic bunch?!? No question, a police officer arresting a criminal caught in the act can't pass the judgement "it's X days / months / years in prison for you for this crime, bub", or, closer to the "case" in question, decide on leniency. But he damn well can snap on the handcuffs and forcibly drag the offender off to first detention (prolongation of which is again, in Germany, a matter to be decided by a judge. They're almost on call 24/7 for such and similar cases, at least decisions are often handed down within 24 hours). And I am absolutely certain Eonwë could have forced Sauron to come back to Aman. So Sauron remaining in Middle-earth, and everything that followed from this addition to the Valar's endless list of dereliction of duty in Middle-earth, is exactly 100% their fault.

Back on topic, in Aman there were several for whom the One Ring would not have posed the slightest risk. Of the Maiar, I would name Eonwë, Melian, and Ossë at least who were more powerful than Sauron (who even at the time of his pouring a greater part of his native power into the One Ring had been severely damaged by his near-fatal - to his bodily form - encounter with Huan). To any and all of the Valar, the ring would hardly have been a plastic trinket. And Aulë would have pulverized the One Ring into oblivion with a single diffident blow of his hammer. Indolent derelict wimps, the lot of them. 😡💩


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## Phantom718 (Mar 5, 2020)

Olorgando said:


> The Council of Elrond" in Book Two of "Fellowship" (this is Elrond speaking): 'And those wo dwell beyond the sea would not receive it: for good or ill it belongs to Middle-earth; it is for us who still dwell here to deal with it.'
> 
> That's *RICH*! "It's not _*our*_ fault!" That's a Himalaya's worth of Baloney Slices!
> 
> And I am absolutely certain Eonwë could have forced Sauron to come back to Aman. So Sauron remaining in Middle-earth, and everything that followed from this addition to the Valar's endless list of dereliction of duty in Middle-earth, is exactly 100% their fault.



I agree that they (the Valar) could've forcibly brought Sauron to Aman when they had the chance(s), and moreover would've had the power to destroy, or at least suppress the ring's power a great deal.

However, Elrond's quote leads me to believe that the Valar pawned this off to M-E on a technicality. "The ring was made in middle earth, hence it's middle earth's problem." In other words, if it was made in Aman or elsewhere, they might have gotten involved. They're pretty subjective bastards aren't they? They saddled up and went over to M-E to deal with Melkor, but just kind of waived the Sauron issue aside. Either they had confidence that those in M-E could handle it themselves, or they just didn't care at that point. They were happy on their little heavenly island away from all the drama. 

Then again, it's kind of like the question of why the eagles didn't just fly the ring directly to Mount Doom; if the Valar put a swift end to Sauron/the ring, then the story would've ended awfully quick 😝


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## Olorgando (Mar 5, 2020)

Oh no, I'm having a "Monty Python attack" again.
Health warning etc. (you should know what I mean by that by now …)

See, when Mandos pronounced his doom (and prophecy) while the rebelling Noldor were still heading north in Aman, Manwë installed, on Taniquetil, a big-screen, high-resolution TV system (at least 4K - what am I saying, 40K perhaps 400K, and Dolby Surround is a 50 cent transistor radio compared to that equipment!) so the Valar and Maiar could follow to goings-on in Middle-earth - the first soap opera / telenovela. At the end of the War of Wrath, Eonwë actually did clap Sauron in irons, and some of the others rounded up all of the Balrogs, Dragons, Orcs and whatnot baddies in Middle-earth. But Manwë fires off a heated WhatsApp-like message telling him "Are you daft?!? The programming will become boring-to-death if you eliminate all of the baddies. You jut immediately release all of them, especially Sauron, Mandos says he's good for at least 6500 years of more viewing fun!"
Maybe I'm just channeling the Game of Thrones producers here, or those of other programs I find on the smaller private TV channels that seem to star Zombies, Vampires, Investment Bankers ...


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## grendel (Mar 5, 2020)

Olorgando said:


> This leads me to one of my "favorite hobbies" about Arda: Valar-bashing.



I'm with you on the Valar-bashing, brother.



Phantom718 said:


> However, Elrond's quote leads me to believe that the Valar pawned this off to M-E on a technicality. "The ring was made in middle earth, hence it's middle earth's problem."



A technicality, yes, and pure bunk. Didn't Mandos say to Feanor, "Manwe is King of Arda, and not of Aman only."? Of course it should be their problem, they started the whole effin' thing!


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## Phantom718 (Mar 6, 2020)

grendel said:


> I'm with you on the Valar-bashing, brother.
> 
> 
> 
> A technicality, yes, and pure bunk. Didn't Mandos say to Feanor, "Manwe is King of Arda, and not of Aman only."? Of course it should be their problem, they started the whole effin' thing!



Yep. The things that come to mind initially when trying to slap any type of justification on the Valar's inaction are that:

1. They got involved with Melkor and that basically broke the world, so they couldn't/didn't want to risk that again. (Basically the "nah, we are fine over here, thanks" attitude.)
2. They had the foresight and confidence to know that the remaining good people of M-E could (albeit barely) handle this themselves,
3. In keeping with the whole "the time of elves is over/time of man is about to begin" theme, they simply felt it was best to not be involved.

Just spitballing there. But in any case, their ignoring of the situation was, as you said, total BS. Like, even if they sent ONE of them to help at the Black Gates in case Sauron appeared...but, no.


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## CirdanLinweilin (Mar 6, 2020)

Phantom718 said:


> 1. They got involved with Melkor and that basically broke the world, so they couldn't/didn't want to risk that again. (Basically the "nah, we are fine over here, thanks" attitude.)


Yeah, I doubt they'd want more of Middle-earth to be Beleriand'd.



CL


🤪


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## Kolbitar (Mar 6, 2020)

Musings on the issue: The Ring, like Jormungandr (as Ouroboros biting its own tail), the Midgard serpent, is like chaos or entropy symbolized--no mortal can overcome these things ultimately. But, as in the Anglo-Saxon and Northern mythological stories Tolkien drew upon, regarding Fate and the practice of honor--(as a central theme in Beowulf) it was the role of a good man, and a good king to face all trouble to arise. And just as Beowulf faced and defeated foe-after-foe, he finally encountered the dragon--faced it--and succumbed. Frodo faced foe-after-foe until he faced the cracks of doom for which he sought--and doom, as a noun means death, destruction, or a terrible fate, and as a verb, it means condemnation to the inevitable. He was broken physically (his finger) but likely first emotionally (worn down), and then intellectually (with his choice). He saw that all inevitable chaos lay before him, and to stave it off temporarily for the sake of others, he walked straight towards it. What caused his break? It was (speculatively) probably quick and terrible. The cracks-of-doom held exponential pressure. What caused the intellectual break? The movement of Will? It was like stepping in front of a speeding truck to save a loved one--one can resist the momentum, but will be moved and will be broken.


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## Aramarien (Mar 6, 2020)

Olorgando said:


> From chapter II "The Council of Elrond" in Book Two of "Fellowship" (this is Elrond speaking): 'And those wo dwell beyond the sea would not receive it: for good or ill it belongs to Middle-earth; it is for us who still dwell here to deal with it.'


It's interesting that Elrond would say this. Elrond Half-elven had never been to Arda. How would he know? Perhaps this was more of his opinion? 

As for Frodo, the choice he made at the end could be quite simple. He was no longer able to fight the strength of the Ring, especially at the height of its power. One could think of someone being tortured and tormented relentlessly day and night and finally had no more strength to fight and gave up because they literally had no power left to fight. 
Frodo said to Sam on Mt. Doom, "....I am almost in its power now. I could not give it up, and if you tried to take it I should go mad."

I think that really says it all.


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## CirdanLinweilin (Mar 6, 2020)

Aramarien said:


> It's interesting that Elrond would say this. Elrond Half-elven had never been to Arda. How would he know? Perhaps this was more of his opinion?
> 
> As for Frodo, the choice he made at the end could be quite simple. He was no longer able to fight the strength of the Ring, especially at the height of its power. One could think of someone being tortured and tormented relentlessly day and night and finally had no more strength to fight and gave up because they literally had no power left to fight.
> Frodo said to Sam on Mt. Doom, "....I am almost in its power now. I could not give it up, and if you tried to take it I should go mad."
> ...


I think you mean Valinor, as Arda is the planet.


CL


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## Aramarien (Mar 6, 2020)

I stand corrected!!!


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## CirdanLinweilin (Mar 6, 2020)

Aramarien said:


> I stand corrected!!!


 XD


CL


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## BalrogRingDestroyer (Mar 7, 2020)

Olorgando said:


> It might appear so. The same seems to hold for the Nazgûl, who certainly seem, west of the Misty Mountains, far less effective that what Boromir reports about their (especially the Witch-king's) effect when Sauron's forces took Osgiliath. But this is, from external evidence, iffy territory. Book One in "Fellowship" still bears the mark of being a "New Hobbit" to some degree. JRRT did not revise it entirely to come into line atmospherically with the later parts of LoTR (which I, truth be told, find to be one of its strengths - none of this A to Z hyperventilation that seems to be thought necessary in so many thriller or the like movies; the "Alien" quadrilogy with Sigourney Weaver, especially the first one, does not have the "monster" rampaging onscreen all the time. Suspense works otherwise (or used to work so; maybe parts of the younger generation need to be hit over the head with the thrill bat 24/7 …  ))
> 
> This leads me to one of my "favorite hobbies" about Arda: Valar-bashing. Especially in several parts of HoMe, I thought "why did Eru allow this bunch of indolent wimps to enter Arda, especially as their opponent was that nihilistic psychopath Melkor?!? And the _über_-wimp is Manwë!!!!!"
> From chapter II "The Council of Elrond" in Book Two of "Fellowship" (this is Elrond speaking): 'And those wo dwell beyond the sea would not receive it: for good or ill it belongs to Middle-earth; it is for us who still dwell here to deal with it.'
> ...



Speaking of Huan, why DIDN'T he finish the job and destroy Sauron's body? 

As for why they didn't go into Middle Earth and kick Sauron's butt War of Wrath style, I'm thinking that it had something to do with how much damage the War of Wrath did to Arda. 

Think, if just the fight between Gandalf and the Balrog caused all the mess in Moria and on that mountain, think of what a Valar attack on Mordor could have done to Gondor, being so close to Mordor.

If they had wanted to, they could have sent Gandalf, Saruman, Radagast, and the Blue Wizards with their FULL power into Middle Earth to depose Sauron had they wanted, but instead they let them in only with partial power.


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## Elthir (Mar 7, 2020)

CirdanLinweilin said:


> Yeah, I doubt they'd want more of Middle-earth to be Beleriand'd.



Just looking in to see if Glorfindel had been mentioned here (for some reason) . . . and I'm rewarded with this "verb" . . . awesome 😄


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## Phantom718 (Mar 9, 2020)

Aramarien said:


> It's interesting that Elrond would say this. Elrond Half-elven had never been to Arda. How would he know? Perhaps this was more of his opinion?



It could be his opinion based on what he instinctively knows (an educated guess, if you will.)

On the other hand, Elrond might have learned the Valar wouldn't receive the ring from counsel with Cirdan, or through Elostirion/Master Stone palantir'ing


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## Olorgando (Mar 10, 2020)

BalrogRingDestroyer said:


> Speaking of Huan, why DIDN'T he finish the job and destroy Sauron's body?


In The Sil, part Quenta Silmarillion chapter 19 "Of Beren and Lúthien", Huan battling Sauron has made it clear beyond a shadow of a doubt that he could destroy Sauron's First Age body, yet still Lúthien says "... unless thou yield to me the mastery of thy tower."

Excuse me?

Even if Huan does damage to Sauron that would at least match that of the destruction of his bodily form at the destruction of Númenor, he still somehow retains "mastery" of the First Age's Minas Tirith, if by then renamed Tol-in-Gaurhoth?!?

With the destruction of his One Ring in the Third Age (when he was seriously less powerful than in the First Age) his Barad-dûr, to be assumed to be of at least an order of magnitude (or perhaps more) greater than First Age Minas Tirith crashes into total oblivion. Seems to me like JRRT had some serious reverse engineering to do (and Christopher was not able to do it sans direction for such rewriting) to get The Sil (unpublished during his lifetime) congruent with LoTR (published).

I'll slip into my "heretical" mode as far as Middle-earth is concerned once again. At the time JRRT wrote that bit above, it seems that especially the baddies (or at least one non-trivial one) had some lasting power to their spells that don't make sense, not to me, anyway. He also seems (pre-figuring PJ's little mental sickness) have allowed the evil side to recuperate almost at will, without giving the slightest explanation how this could be possible. This might be something deeply ingrained in his personal experience. Looking at the news in especially, but not by far solely on electronic media, one (I) might have some serious problems in trying to dispel such a view ...🤮


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## MrUnderhill (Mar 10, 2020)

Aramarien said:


> BalrogRingDestroyer, it is a good question. Gollum and even Bilbo possessed the Ring, or were possessed by the Ring and BOTH called it their precious. Bilbo was the only one in the history of the Ring to voluntarily give up the Ring with all of Gandalf's help.
> 
> I have always felt CHOICE was an important theme in LOTR. Frodo CHOSE to claim the Ring.
> "I have come,' he said. "But* I do not choose* now to do what I came to do. I will not do this deed. The Ring is mine!!" [ROTK , Mount Doom]
> ...


Really great points! I especially agree with your point regarding the centrality of choice and personal will to the LOTR story. When reading through LOTR earlier this year, I made a special point of dog-earing pages/underlining passages where characters or the narrator emphasize that a choice is to be made or a particular course of action is "willed." I must have close to 100 pages marked...maybe even more, but I haven't gone back and counted!

I'm inclined to agree regarding the idea that nobody would have been able to withstand the full force of the Ring. I've heard people point out that nobody criticizes Frodo for succumbing to the Ring's power in the aftermath of its destruction. While that could be explained by the fact that nobody was going to complain after a tremendous victory, it could also certainly speak to the notion that they recognized the near impossibility of resisting the Ring's full strength.


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