# When you read LotR for the first time..



## shadowfax_g (Mar 29, 2002)

When you read the LotR for the first time, were you convinced that:

1) Gandalf was gone at Moria for ever?
2) Frodo was dead by Shelob's attack?

As for me,
1) Yes. I totaly believed then, but before I reached "The White Rider", I happened to find a description of '.. said Gandalf' in later part (stupid of me!).

2) No. I did not think a hero would die in the middle of the story.

How about you?


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## Khamul (Mar 29, 2002)

1. Yes, I thought that they would both die by the fall.

2. Yes, I thought Sam was going to take his master's place as the RingBearer.


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## Beorn (Mar 29, 2002)

Yes and Unsure...

For the first question, on my first reading, I actually stopped reading the book for a few days because I was upset...

When I read the attack by Shelob, I was actually unsure whether he was actually living...


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## Nicholas Blake (Mar 29, 2002)

1) Yes! I did, I was bummed that the old geezer bought the farm, and cheered (Literally) after I read the White Rider chapter. Actually, I had no idea who "Mithrandir" was, so it tooke even longer for me to figure out that Gandalf returned... 

2) Yes! Sam had started to become my favorite character, and I thought it was a great twist that Sam was the new hero. Then, I let out a sigh of relief when Frodo was found to be alive! 

And, what about:

3) Did you think that Pippin died under the troll at the Black Gates?

Me, yes (again)! Pippin was another favorite character of mine, and I drew a sketch of (my interpretation of) Pippin and used it as a bookmark in a homage to the little guy. Of course, I was quite confused after the ring had been destroyed, and low and behold: Pippin lives!


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## Courtney (Mar 30, 2002)

1. Yes.
2. Yes, I was so sure that i cried...
3. Yes again. I figured one of the hobbits would die...


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## Rohansangel (Mar 30, 2002)

1) No, I actually didn't think Gandalf had died, as weird as it seems ... Maybe my sense of reasoning was stronger at age 8. 

2) I did think he died, but when he was captured I was convinced he must have been alive. 

"and that's all I have to say about that"

~The Angel of Rohan


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## Shadowfax (Mar 31, 2002)

1) no, I didn't think that he would die, I don't know why. maybe because my dad had died a week earlier than when I read that oart, and it didn't seem to me like he had gotten their greif right... I dunno.

2) At first, yes (i cried ), but then I realized it couldn't be, because i had recently bought a book of Tolkien illustrations, and there was a picture in there of Frodo facing down Saruman n tSotS, so I knew it could't be.

3) yes, it made me mad (Pip is my fav character)


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## legoman (Mar 31, 2002)

a) not in the slightest, Gandalf is the ultimate charater in the book, he's THE wizard they couldn't kill him off. but then a friend of mine went on for ages (after I'd read that and before I got to the bit were he reappears) and actually convinced me that he had died. I was glad he did cos then I enjoyed the fact that he survived even more.

b) I wasn't sure, after the above thing I thought that they wouldn't kill him off and I'd been told that old frodo lost a finger, so I presumed he wasn't.

almost forgot
c)no, the writing didn't seem to be dramatic enough to be a death scene, one second he's on a horse, the next he's under a troll.


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## Rohansangel (Mar 31, 2002)

Almost forgot -- 

I didn't think Pippin had died, I liked the little guy too much to think he had died. Whenever a character I like dies, I go into denial ... it's a thing with me. I did, however, think he was doomed when Old Man Willow swallowed him up. And I'd like to add that as a question, if you don't mind --- 

4) Did you think that Merry and Pippin would die when Old Man Willow swallowed them up?

~The Angel of Rohan


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## Anarchist (Mar 31, 2002)

1)Yes I believed he had died, but something deep inside me told me that we hadn't seen the last of the old guy yet.

2)Yes, I actually thought he had died for good. My heart was crushed for some time, in the choices of master Sam, but I kept on reading till the end of the book. I was so surprised when I read about Frodo being alive that the book sliped from my hands and fell on the floor.

3)Yes, I trully believed this, and felt proud of Pippin, having the most glorious death. But I was also relieved to see him alive.

4)No, not for a moment. I was sure that someone would save them.


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## shadowfax_g (Mar 31, 2002)

I should answer 3) and 4)  

No and No. I hadn't thought of their death even the slightest. Compared with Boromir's death scene, they were too quick and easy for the death of main characters.


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## EverEve (Mar 31, 2002)

1~ Yes, I was very upset. But I accidently dropped my book, and when I picked it up I saw 'Gandalf' written on one of the pages.
2~ Yes. I cried. I thought it was horrible to kill Frodo off in the middle of the book. But, again, I was flipping through the book randomly and I saw his name in the back. How horrible am I? 
3~ Not at all. Dont know why I didnt think he was dead, I just didnt.
4~ Absolutely not. How could they kill off two characters in the VERY BEGINNING of the book.


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## Quercus (Mar 31, 2002)

1) No. It just didn't seem reasonable that Gadalf would die even before the end of the first book. And when the elves said he had fallen into shadow (instead of died)I knew I was right.

2) Yes. Frodo was my favorite character and I figured it would be my luck that he would die. I almost stopped reading the book then and there!

3) No. It seemed to be handled too lightly, besides, how could JRRT kill off little Pippin?

4) No. It never even crossed my mind that they might be doomed. That's always been one of my favorite parts of the story, actually.


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## Shadowfax (Apr 2, 2002)

to #4) I did not think that Pip and Merry were doomed, but I did think that if bad stuff was happening to them before the had barely left the Shire, they were probably going to come back with severe emotional trauma from the Quest. btw, this is kinda off the subject, but did anyone ever feel really sorry for M&P? esp. Pip? I mean they are pretty much the b***hes of the whole story! Everything happens to them! When will they ever get a break?!


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## Mithrandir (Apr 2, 2002)

1. Yes when Gandalf fell into the pit I actually stopped reading the book for a whole week because I was so angry.

2. Yes but I was not that upset.

3.Yes i did and yet again I was very angered but too intrigued to stop reading because I was at the end.

4. No I did not, I just couldn't stop laughing. Just imagine a big tree with these random fury feet sticking out of the side, heehee It still makes me laugh.
~Mithers


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## Niniel (Apr 2, 2002)

1. No, I thought Gandalf was too mighty to be killed just like that, although I was surprised that he reappeared just at the moment that he did; I wasn't sure then that it was Gandalf (I thought it might be Saruman).
2. No, I didn't think the hero of the story would be killed before the end. But it is a very sad part of the book, and I cried when I read it!
3. At first I thought Pip had died, but I couldn't really believe it. He is one of my favorite characters (after Merry), so how could they kill him???
4. No, I just thought it was funny, but not that they would die of it.


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## Greenwood (Apr 2, 2002)

1)Yes. I was crushed. I first read LOTR nearly 40 years ago and I still remember the shock.

2)I wasn't sure. I thought probably yes, but you find out very that he is not dead so I don't really remember very well.

3)Yes. Having read The Hobbit some years earlier and thus knowing that Tolkien was an author who could kill main characters at the end, I thought he probably was dead.

4)No. As EverEve said, it was way to early in the book to be killing characters.


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## Mormegil (Apr 2, 2002)

1. No. I saw Bakshi's version of the film when I was about 5, and when I read the book aged 8 or 9, I remembered things. I knew that Gandalf would return.

2. Yes, I thought Frodo was dead and that Sam would cemplete the quest. 

3. No, I didn't think Pippin was dead, but I don't know why. I should have, the way it was written.

4. No. It was more funny than scary.


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## Camille (Apr 2, 2002)

Ok let me see.

1) No, I read TTT before FOTR  so I knew that Gandalf did not die.
2) Yes I was sure that frodo have died and that Sam would finally cast the ring in the mount doom.
3) MM no didnt think that Pipin was dead.
4) Again no I was hoping that Tom or Frodo would do something.

and I have another question that really really surprised me:

5) Did you notice that Dermhelm was Eowyn???
I did not it was a big surprise!!!


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## Shadowfax (Apr 2, 2002)

To #5: That totally suprised me! I was thinking that there were going to be no good female characters, and it was really cheesing me off!(Inspite of my alias, yes I am of the fairer sex) I had stayed home from school "sick" (heeheeheehee!) to finish off TTT and RotK. I actually squealed when I read, "It is no man that faces you, but a WOMAN!" *shivers*


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## YayGollum (Apr 2, 2002)

1. No. My evil dad told me that he lived, but he never told me how.
2. No. My evil dad told me that he lived, but he never told me how.
3. No. I thought it would be just like Bilbo. Getting knocked out towards the beginning of the fight so he doesn't have to worry about it.
4. No. That's crazy! Way too early in the book!
5. Of course I knew it was her! But then, the first time I read the books I was like, 15.

Would people be mad if I mad a 6th one? It's really good too. Did you think that Gollum died? He didn't really. Yes, I thought that he died, but then I thought about it and you can all see my theory in Gollum's Diary on page 13. It's the truth!


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## Niniel (Apr 3, 2002)

5. I completely not noticed it! Very well done by JRRT!
6. I didn't think he was dead (where does it say he died?), but I was surprised when it turned out he was following them. I was even more surprised however, when no one of the Fellowship really seemed shocked about it, it was as if they expected it.


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## shadowfax_g (Apr 3, 2002)

5) Yes, I was sure that Éowyn would join the Riders. Didn't she say to Merry, 'we shall meet again'? Men wouldn't understand Merry's desire. Only Éowyn, who also was not allowed to go, could give hand to Merry. So it was obvious to me that the Rider who helped Merry was she.
(I was well grown-up when I read it, as you guess)

6) Mmm..interesting diary.. but I think Gollum had lived long enough his pitiful and lonely life. Let him go in honour now...


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## Lantarion (Apr 3, 2002)

1. Well the obvious reaction was that Gandalf had croaked, and wasn't coming back. It was a very surreal state of mind, thinking that (after having read the Hobbit) such a jolly old man could just up and die! But I wasn't quite sure, it seemed too easy..

2. Yes, I thought he was dead, seriously. It seemed possible, although quite cruel.

3. Pippin was pretty nastily struck, sure, but I didn't think he had died.

4. Nah. It was a frightening situation, but at least them it seemed ludicrous to me that a tree could kill anybody. A _tree_!

5. I sort of guessed, because s/he was a bit quiet and mysterious, and.. I dunno, but although I sort of guessed it was still great to find out.

6. [Niniel, Gollum fell into the Sammath Naur] I think he did die, and it does seem logical that such a torn character would eventually die fulfilling a good deed.


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## Camille (Apr 3, 2002)

6. Gollum die!!!!  Of course he died, but poor Gollum I kind of like him I feel pity for him.


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## Niniel (Apr 4, 2002)

Oh, that's what you mean. I didn't understand you at first. Yes, I thought Gollum died, but I wasn't sad about it... it seemed to me that right ending to the story, that an 'evil' creature like Gollum saved the world with his death.


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## Hanne (Apr 4, 2002)

1.No,ofcourse not!!!They were always saying:he has fallen into shadow and things like that,they never said he is dead
2.Also no,it was impossible that Frodo was dead because he was the true Ringbearer and not Sam.And the hero doesn't die in the middle of the story!!!


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## Lantarion (Apr 4, 2002)

Actually, he can and it would be a fiersomely excellent plot twist if Frodo wasn't such an important character (Bilbo's, the original Ring-finder's, cousin). 
Welcome to the forum, Hanne!


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## Lindir (Apr 4, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Hanne _
> *And the hero doesn't die in the middle of the story!!! *



I take it you have not read 'A song of Ice and Fire' then?


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## Hanne (Apr 4, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Lindir _
> *
> 
> I take it you have not read 'A song of Ice and Fire' then?  *


No,I have not.Or maybe but I can't remember.But I mean,in such an important story he can't!!!!


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## tobiwan15 (Apr 5, 2002)

1) Yes, I thought Gandalf was dead. Never even questioned it. However, when he showed up, alive again, somehow, I wasn't in the least bit surprised. Resurrections are big in fantasies.

2) Deep down, I think I knew he wasn't dead, but it was just SO SAD, because SAM thought he was dead, that I tried not to reason it out. I was literally sobbing as I read through "The Choices of Master Samwise". But as Gandalf says, not all tears are evil.. 

3) Nah, at that point, Boromir was the only one who stayed dead (seems unfair!) so I figured someone would find Pippin.

4) Never thought they were gonners. Always figured Frodo would get them out of the willow.

5) Nope, completely missed the Dernhelm/Eowyn thing. Felt kind of foolish when it was revealed.

6) OK, fell into a fiery pit that destroyed even the One Ring. Gollum is toast.

Tobiwan


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## Anamatar IV (Apr 6, 2002)

no-i was sure that gandalf was going to have some part in the pverthrow of saruman (at least i predicted that they wuld attack him) and if it wernt for the cheap adnf fake trailor i wouldve thoughtt he was dead.


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## Nicholas Blake (Apr 7, 2002)

4) Of course Pip and Merry couldn't die at the beginning like that!

5) I figured this out right at first. Such a mysterious character who just happens to help Merry. And, what kind of name is "Dernhelm" anyway? Very obivous to me.

6) Of course he died you dipsticks!


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## elvish-queen (Apr 7, 2002)

I thought Gandalf and Frodo had died, and I wept for ages, (specially 'bout frodo!). But none of the others could have died xcept boromir, and that was obvious, and I was glad!


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## Pippin/Frodo (May 6, 2002)

no
no
no
no
I heard it on cd first and I knew that nothing like that would happen to the main characters though one time I resd this book and theres a main guy and a main gal and they like eachother alot and the girl dies ant the end. I'm still upset that Frodo left hos best friend poor sam torn in two and sad.

Did you think that when Pippin saw his pall that guy that starts eith a B fall that he died? I did.

Or what about when Sam sang that song and tried to find Frodo and it worked and he didn't give up, Was it just me or did you want to get up on something high and sing the song and say something like. You go Sam you stout hearted hobbit save your master and kill the orcs.

Or both times when frodo ket the ring take him over as that kinda freaky or what/


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## Pippin/Frodo (May 6, 2002)

oh nd about eowyn the voice on the cd's gave it away.

and Ofcours Gollum is dead he was old anyway.


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## Ice Man (May 7, 2002)

1 - No, a friend of mine had accidently told me about it before I got to finish reading the book;
2 - No, I fussed the appendixes before I finished reading the book and I saw that Frodo had survived the entire advanture.

But I did feel like crying once I finished reading LOTR. Somehow, I was very sad that it came to an end. It was like losing friends at the same moment I discovered they were my friends. I still don't like to read the last chapter.


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## Eithne (May 7, 2002)

Well, I must admit that I didn't read the books until after the movie, and heard that Gandalf doens't die, so that ruined it for me. But I did think Frodo was dead from Shelob. That part was so sad, Sam talking to the 'dead' Frodo in the tower *sniff* yes I'm a sap...


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## Pippin/Frodo (May 7, 2002)

Arcanjo,

I cryed too. Alot. I still can't believe it. I hate the ending. I even continued my own story with Elanor because It was so upseting and part of my story is on the somrthing forum under "I must know someine elses oppinion." thread. It made me feel better so check it out and give your oppinion.


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## Shadowfax (May 7, 2002)

I cried for three hours after I finished RotK. I still get choked up.


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## Pippin/Frodo (May 7, 2002)

Me too. When ever I see it read it or hear about it I get kinda upset and I've heard it like seven times


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## ROSEY (May 7, 2002)

yes to all of the above im very gullible,and your not a sap eithne,did anyone not cry once during the whole book?if your a sap for crying then im one to.


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## shadowfax_g (May 8, 2002)

I didn't cry when I finished, but felt very very sad and could not think of any other things for at least one entire week..
I thought I would not enjoy reading the second time as much as the first time, but actually, I found I did.


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## Niniel (May 8, 2002)

Normally I don't really cry about books or films, but I've read LoTR at least six times now, and I still start crying when I get to end, and Frodo and Sam saying goodbye and everything... silly really, but I can't help it.


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## ROSEY (May 8, 2002)

yeah it is a bit silly when you think about it i cried twice once when frodo died i thought that he wouldnt be back and that sam would take his place i felt so sorry for poor sam,and at the end of the book as well when everyone was dying.Why couldnt they live forever with legolas .


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## Legolam (May 8, 2002)

1. I didn't think Gandalf was dead. I don't know why, I just didn't think that he would be killed off. But it took until getting on to this forum last year that I realised he'd been resurrected!

2. Yes, I was convinced that Frodo was dead. I was devastated! And then I was really upset that he was caught by the orcs and Sam was (apparently) unable to save him

3. Yup, I thought Pippin would die because Bilbo didn't and you can't have the eagles saving two books. But I was wrong!!

4. No, I didn't think Merry and Pip would die so early on

5. I sooooo didn't get the whole Dernhelm thing. I'm pretty thick

6. Yes, Gollum is well and truly dead (sorry Yay!)


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