# Are the Nazgul the owners of the nine rings of the mortals??



## Denethor (Jun 25, 2002)

Are they the nine mortals that own the rings , Or these rings are missing??


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## My_Precious (Jun 25, 2002)

Yes those are the nine rings. That's why nagzul is sometimes called "ringwraith". 
I'm not good at explaining, but soon other people will post here some quotes from the Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, Or Tolkien's Letters, explain everything, and tell you how Nazgul affected all the Middle Earth, their power, maybe even their names(?)...

EDIT: I'm not an english speaking person, and it was late, so I couldn't phrase it the right way. Sorry.


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## Rangerdave (Jun 25, 2002)

No quotes, no letters, no stirring passages. Just plain English.

The nine Nazgul/Ringwraiths are the former owners of the nine rings made for motal man. As they wore these rings they eventually came under the complete control of Sauron and withered into shadows and shades. The nine rings were thene recovered by Sauron thereby giving him complete mastery over the nazgul. Simple huh?

As for their names, no one knows for sure as that knowlidge is lost, but I have a suspicion that they are all named Zathras.

RD


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## pohuist (Jun 25, 2002)

The name of the second in command is mentioned in UT in the chapter "the hunt for the ring". I don;t remember it and don't havbe the book, so whoever is interested -- look it up.


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## pohuist (Jun 25, 2002)

From the Annals of Arda,
http://www.annalsofarda.dk/annals-of-arda/Others-index-tables/Others.htm 

The Witch-King headed the Ringwraiths, until his death. Then his second, Khamul took over until all the ringwraiths were destroyed in the wreck of Sauron. 
Khamul is named in the books, see the article about him. 
Fuinor and Herumor are two other ringwraiths named in the Silmarillion, "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age". They were "black Numenoreans", some of many who had been turned to Sauron while he sojourned among them. These two, among others, escaped the sinking of Numenor by sailing to Middle-earth, where they rose to become Lords of the Herudrim. 
Other names and origins for the Ringwraiths are given by Iron Crown Enterprises in their card game, as approved by the Tolkien estate. These names are included for role-playing and so that the reader of this encyclopedia will know the source of the name when he sees it. This list is ordered by rank: The Witch-King is called Murezor. Khamul remains the same. Dwar from Waw. Indur from Kornande. Akhoril from Numenor. Hoarmurath from Dir. Adunaphel the Quiet from Numenor. Ren the Unclean from Eastern Endor. Uvathar the Horseman from Eastern Endor.


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## Mithril (Jun 25, 2002)

*nazgul question*

how do the ringwraiths die? i thought that aragorn said that the were neither living nor dead. and if sauron gave them rings and they fell into shadow then why didnt the elves or the dwarves?


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## Gamil Zirak (Jun 26, 2002)

The elves didn't fall into the shadow and weren't even influenced by Saruon because Sauron never made or touched for that matter the three elven rings. The dwarves were too hardy to succom to the power of Sauron. Their rings only increased their lust for gold and gems.


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## Cian (Jun 26, 2002)

> _Originally posted by pohuist _
> Fuinor and Herumor are two other ringwraiths named in the Silmarillion, "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age". They were "black Numenoreans", some of many who had been turned to Sauron while he sojourned among them. These two, among others, escaped the sinking of Numenor by sailing to Middle-earth, where they rose to become Lords of the Herudrim.



Where is it said that these lords were actually Nazgûl? The Nazgûl appear about Second Age 2251 and Sauron was not even taken as prisoner to Númenor until SA 3262.




> Other names and origins for the Ringwraiths are given by Iron Crown Enterprises in their card game, as approved by the Tolkien estate. These names are included for role-playing and so that the reader of this encyclopedia will know the source of the name when he sees it. This list is ordered by rank: The Witch-King is called Murezor. Khamul remains the same. Dwar from Waw. Indur from Kornande. Akhoril from Numenor. Hoarmurath from Dir. Adunaphel the Quiet from Numenor. Ren the Unclean from Eastern Endor. Uvathar the Horseman from Eastern Endor.



Any invented ICE names are indeed "inventions"


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## Gil-Galad (Jun 26, 2002)

I read somewhere in UT that the name of the second nazgul is known.That's the one who went to Saruman to ask him where was the Shire and whether Saruman knew anything about the One.


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## Cian (Jun 26, 2002)

Yep, Khamûl, that's why I said "any"


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## Khamul (Jun 26, 2002)

Is this supposed to be a discussion about whether or not the Nazgul hold the Nine Rings?



> "Some, Galdor," said Gandalf, "would think the tidings of Gloin, and the pursuit of Frodo, proof enough that the halfling's troveis a thing of great worth to the Enemy. Yet it is a ring. What then? The NINE THE NAZGUL keep. The Seven are taken or destroyed."





> Now Sauron learning of the capture of Gollum by the chiefs of his enemies was in great haste and fear. Yet all his ordinary spies and emissaries could bring him no tidings. And this was due largely both to the vigilance of the Dúnedain and to the treachery of Saruman, whose own servants either waylaid or misled the servants of Sauron. Of this Sauron became aware, but his arm was not yet long enough to reach Saruman in Isengard. Therefore he hid his knowledge of Saruman's double-dealing and concealed his wrath, biding his time, and preparing for the great war in which he planned to sweep all his enemies into the western sea. At length he resolved that no others would serve him in this case but his mightiest servants, the Ringwraiths, who had no will but his own, being each utterly subservient to the ring that had enslaved him, which Sauron held.


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## Tyaronumen (Jun 26, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Cian _
> *
> Any invented ICE names are indeed "inventions"  *



Indeed -- which is at least partially a shame, as Adunaphel the Quiet has a really cool background.


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## Tyaronumen (Jun 26, 2002)

Sting... since one of those quotes sounded like Gandalf's opinion/guess, while the other sounds like part of the narrative, I'd tend to lend more credence to the second... after all, we must give at least some credence to the sanity of the narrative (or abandon any hope of a coherent story), while there is no requirement that Gandalf actually be correct in his speculation.


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## Tyaronumen (Jun 26, 2002)

So, where are Herumor and Fuinor mentioned as being Nazgul? I don't recall ever seeing them mentioned as Nazgul...? Can you be a bit more specific as to the passage...?


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## Edhel-dûr (Jun 26, 2002)

Herumor? Fuinor?.......in the Silmarillion???, can anyone write the quote where are mentioned these two names?

Greetings.


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## Tyaronumen (Jun 26, 2002)

Thanks Smeagol! 

I have to say that I would buy the whole 'Gothmog as a Nazgul' theory (which I don't buy  ) before I'd lend too much credence to the H&F story -- at least based on what you've shown here!


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## Gamil Zirak (Jun 26, 2002)

Was the Witch King the Lieutenant? I thought he was the captain.


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## Rangerdave (Jun 26, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Smeagol _
> *
> The rings were not originally made for Mortal Men. *


*
Sorry, my mistake. there is no need to shout.

RD*


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