# Amazing Aragorn



## RangerStryder (Aug 8, 2010)

We read the book and we saw the movie adaptation on how Aragorn came to the hobbits rescue on top of Weathertop.

But how did really Aragorn rescued the hobbits?


C'mon, 5 nazgul including the Witchking and the One Ring is almost in their grasp (opportunity of a lifetime) and they left because this Numenorean came up with a flaming brand (torch) and a broken sword????


Is it because Aragorn is holding a westernese blade? What...the Nazgul cannot sacrificed one or two bodies while the rest flee with the One Ring???



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## Firawyn (Aug 12, 2010)

The chapter (A Knife In The Dark) ends with Aragorn arriving at the scene, and the the next Chapter (Flight to the Ford) starts after the supposed battle has ensued. The only real defense that the book really shows is Frodo crying out "Gilthoniel! O Elbereth!". 

We don't know for certain that there was a battle, persay, just that Aragorn manages to help the hobbits escape. Of course, it would not do at all to have an epic film where the hero's keep running away! The King of Gondor shouldn't run away!


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## Elthir (Aug 12, 2010)

Hammond and Scull note that in Marquette manuscript 4/2/36 Tolkien noted that: _'But the Bearer had been marked with the Knife and (he thinks) cannot last more than a day or two.'_ Also...

'(...) But above all the timid and terrified Bearer had resisted him, had dared to strike at him with an enchanted sword made by his own enemies long ago for his destruction. Narrowly it had missed him. How he had come by it -- save in the Barrows of Cardolan. Then he was in some way mightier than the B[arrow]-wight; and he called on _Elbereth,_ a name of terror to the Nazgul. He was then in league with the High Elves of the Havens.'

'Escaping a wound that would have been as deadly to him as the Mordor-knife to Frodo (as was proved at the end), he withdrew and hid for a while, out of doubt and _fear_ both of Aragorn and especially of Frodo. But fear of Sauron, and the forces of Sauron's will was the stronger.'

Well, in case you missed it in the (at least) two other Tolkien forums you appear to have posted this thread in (nothing wrong with that incidentally, of course).

 

I'm not following you around or anything... I was already there and there and here.​


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## RangerStryder (Aug 12, 2010)

Galin said:


> Hammond and Scull note that in Marquette manuscript 4/2/36 Tolkien noted that: _'But the Bearer had been marked with the Knife and (he thinks) cannot last more than a day or two.'_ Also...
> '(...) But above all the timid and terrified Bearer had resisted him, had dared to strike at him with an enchanted sword made by his own enemies long ago for his destruction. Narrowly it had missed him. How he had come by it -- save in the Barrows of Cardolan. Then he was in some way mightier than the B[arrow]-wight; and he called on _Elbereth,_ a name of terror to the Nazgul. He was then in league with the High Elves of the Havens.'
> 
> 'Escaping a wound that would have been as deadly to him as the Mordor-knife to Frodo (as was proved at the end), he withdrew and hid for a while, out of doubt and _fear_ both of Aragorn and especially of Frodo. But fear of Sauron, and the forces of Sauron's will was the stronger.'
> ...


 
Thank you for informing me about it (actually its 4 different sites), the purpose of posting the same topic in other Tolkien forums is to see different perspective coming from a Tolkien fan like yourself.

From the 'other' sites, we already discussed this 'situation' or scenario quite a bit.

If you re-read the chapter 'A Knife in the Dark' there you will see that the Witchking was holding a sword and a dagger and he is now bearing towards Frodo, but the hobbit on the other hand went towards the Witchking with his own westernese dagger on both hands.

This scene clearly shows usl that the Witchking is not planning to mark Frodo but to kill him (Gandalf mentioned this to Frodo that the Nazgul intends to hit his heart in Rivendell).

But when Frodo stumbled and hit the Witchking first (which cause the Witchking to cry in pain), and that made the Witchking miss his target and instead wound the hobbit in his shoulder.

This happened on Oct. 6.


Now..from the other sites, one guy mentioned the same thing ...that Frodo's fate is sealed because of that wound.

I say...Frodo's fate maybe is sealed but what about the Ring? The Nazgul went away...and there are 4 individuals who can get the One Ring from Frodo (if they think that Frodo is incapacitated in holding the Ring). 

Does the Nazgul intends to look for these 4 individuals again in the woods??? (the Nazgul are having a hard time looking for them in the woods since they left the Shire)

From Oct. 6 until Oct. 20....when the Nazgul again catch-up with Frodo in Rivendell's ford (Bruinen)...that is *14 days* when the Witchking wasted his oppurtunity of picking up the One Ring from the wounded hobbit in Weathertop....even if, lets say Aragorn did show up....4 Nazgul can slow him down and the other one get the Ring from Frodo. Sacrificing their (Nazgul) bodies are sufficient enough in exchange of getting their Master's Precious if they really are more afraid of Sauron's wrath..imo


Now...The Witchking failed to get the One Ring from the hobbit who happened to be wounded in front of him and then after 14 days of looking for his prey (again ...in the woods) ...he and the other 8 Nazgul ended up drowning. 

Put yourself in Sauron's shoes...what do you think you will do to your Witchking? 


Do you get it now?


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## Elthir (Aug 12, 2010)

> Do you get it now?


 

But JRRT didn't say the WK intended merely to mark the Ringbearer in any event. That's what happened after being resisted and so on, and frodo was marked with the knife 'at least'.

The _full context_ of the text I referred to is best of course, but Tolkien notes that it is a strange thing that the camp was not watched while darkness lasted on the night, and the crossing of the Road seems not to have been observed, so that the Witch-king lost track of the Bearer... 

_'For this there were probably several reasons, the least to be expected being the most important...'_ 

Again if you can get a look at the full note that would be best, but basically fear, doubt and dismay played an unexpected part here.



And yes, as I said, there's nothing wrong with posting the same thread at multiple forums. I do it myself sometimes in hopes of getting more feedback.


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## Bucky (Aug 12, 2010)

You must remember that the Nazgul (or Witch-king as commander if you prefer) did not 'waste' 14 days 'searching' in the wild....

The Fords and the bridge over the Hoarwell - both apparently well known to the Witch-king, are impassable except for a single spot like most any river and the Nazgul KNOW they will meet Frodo at those points. They are aware that the only known foe that can match them in the area, Gandalf, has been chased far away and won't be around to save Frodo. 
Why would they expect a High Elf to come wandering along at just the right moment to save Frodo?

BTW Ranger Strider: I tried to join one of those other sites REPEATEDLY; It's got the name Elrond in it (hint hint), but admin NEVER returned my calls.


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## RangerStryder (Aug 13, 2010)

I am not the right person to answer that for I am not really familiar (personally) to any admins in that site. 

Have you also chk. one of the new member (he use his own pic as his avatar) in another site where I go 'hint' 'hint, he is a Tolkien scholar (well known) and published several Tolkien related books and host of a Tolkien radio is frequenting the said site and his postings/opinions are well recieved. (he is worth one of your visits) 




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## Elthir (Aug 13, 2010)

What site are you referring to with the Tolkien scholar please?

Or are we not allowed to mention, by name, other forums here? I note that the FAQ states that we may reference other sites, but one may not link to another site that is not his or her own (to drive traffic there).

Unless I'm reading that wrong! _I think_ we can refer to another website or forum by name.


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## RangerStryder (Aug 13, 2010)

Galin said:


> What site are you referring to with the Tolkien scholar please?
> 
> Or are we not allowed to mention, by name, other forums here? I note that the FAQ states that we may reference other sites, but one may not link to another site that is not his or her own (to drive traffic there).
> 
> Unless I'm reading that wrong! _I think_ we can refer to another website or forum by name.


Middle-earth Center


He is not going to be active from this weekend until next week for he is a guest and a host to a Tolkien fans convention event....something.
http://www.tolkienmoot.org/


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## Bucky (Aug 14, 2010)

I was referring to thecouncilofelrond.whatever

Not much action there, but at least they seem to stick to facts, unlike that BIG site where everthing is twisted into...

"Well to me I think the text means this, regardless of the quotes you produce that are facts."


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## RangerStryder (Aug 15, 2010)

Bucky said:


> I was referring to thecouncilofelrond.whatever
> 
> Not much action there, but at least they seem to stick to facts, unlike that BIG site where everthing is twisted into...
> 
> "Well to me I think the text means this, regardless of the quotes you produce that are facts."


 
I know you meant CoE (the MeC answer is for Galin's question - #8) and I answered your question (look @ post #7), Im not familiar with their other departments/section; they have a lot, and I only frequent their Library/book forum section so I only know the guy who manage that forum.

What 'BIG' site are you talking about?

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