# Most Inexplicable Plot Flaw



## Goro Shimura (Mar 6, 2002)

Okay... which one was the straw the broke the Camel's back?

It's ruined forever, my precious! Forever!

(Looks for a sniveling gollum smiley... fails to find one... attempts to improvise....)

o 
O {


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## Melian (Mar 6, 2002)

And what about the eternal Entwives' mystery...


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## baraka (Mar 6, 2002)

Aragorn´s decision to leave Frodo and Sam and follow Merry and Pippin.


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## Harad (Mar 6, 2002)

And what about Frodo putting the Ring back on 2 minutes and 100 yards from where he just barely escaped Sauron on Amon Hen?


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## Aredhel (Mar 6, 2002)

I would have to say the flaw is Aragorn's idiotic decision to go after Merry and Pippin.


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## Eonwe (Mar 6, 2002)

this poll's just gunna keep getting larger...  Personally the orc-sergeant not noticing them is where I suspended my suspended disbelief.

Its not as bad as midsummer night's dream!


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## daisy (Mar 7, 2002)

Nothing's as bad as Midsummer Night's Dream - except maybe Bride of Chucky.

I definitely went for the hobbit in orc's clothing deal - much like a certain Storm Trooper costume party on the Death Star, hmmmm?


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## aragil (Mar 7, 2002)

I don't know about the 'Hobbit's as Orcs' thing. I mean, it seems like as often as not good folks are worried about being mistaken for Orcs. Eomer almost mistakes Aragorn and co. for Orcs, Merry and Pippin are worried about being mistaken for Orcs by Eomer, and Treebeard says he would have taken Merry and Pippin to be Orcs if he hadn't first heard their voices. Perhaps Orcs weren't really supposed to look as different as artists' conceptions would lead us to believe. I mean, Frodo and Sam deliberately took Orc gear so that they would look like Orcs, so there must have been (built into the novels at that point) some possibility for the disguise to work, otherwise why bother with the Orc-gear? It's not like it felt good on the skin, or made their journey any quicker.

Anyway, I ain't voting. There's no plot point that can't be explicated on some level.


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## Eonwe (Mar 7, 2002)

they should've worn the Orc garb from Hobbiton to Rivendell 

Well the garments of Lorien had a bit to do with some of these cases you think?


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## Hama (Mar 7, 2002)

The road from Hobbiton to Rivendell was not one regularly used and infested by orcs. So they would have looked out of place, and may even have been attacked by people from around, who on the other hand, were used to seeing Hobbits. Remember, few people outside Eriador had even heard of hobbits, let alone seen them. So I doubt some lower level orc would think about looking around for halflings in the middle of Mordor. And from HObbiton to Rivendell the main danger was from the Nazgul who would not care what guise the hobbits were in, because a) they could smell them out and b) they were attracted to the ring.
There are a few inexplicable points in the book, but each had its purpose and added some spice to the dramatics of the work. Which is why it made such good reading.


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## Grond (Mar 8, 2002)

I chose none of the above because I am a true and loyal Tolkien fan. Besides, I added the choice.


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## Aldanil (Mar 8, 2002)

For which right-minded option we are most grateful, O Grond!

(though I persist in believing Goroshimura's intent for this poll is sarcastic...)


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## Beleg Strongbow (Mar 8, 2002)

I find nothing wrong with the story the only thing i am dissapointed with is the lack of knowledge of m.e. Even though there is massibve amounts of it. I would love more.


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## Uminya (Mar 8, 2002)

I agree with Grond. All of those so-called plot failures can be explained if you look more closely (I might get around to it if nobody else does  )


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## Dûndorer (Mar 8, 2002)

well, i think that there isnt any bad plots either. 'cause if there was soooooooooooooooooooooooooo many people wouldn't like the books. but as you can see there is numerous amounts of people like them.


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## Arthur_Vandelay (Feb 20, 2004)

> Sauron should have scoured Mordor for halflings when he recieved Frodo's belongings...



I always thought the presence of Frodo's belongings should have raised alarm bells in the Dark Tower--especially since Sauron's servants were supposed to be on the lookout for halflings. I suppose it could be explained by the possibility that Sauron simply assumed that Aragorn, marching towards the Morannon, already had the Ring in his possession. Then again, wasn't Sauron's motto: Assumption is the mother of all stuff-ups?


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## Iluvatar (Feb 20, 2004)

I voted for Sauron not scouring Mordor looking for halfling. Let's see. A halfling has the Ring at our last knowledge. A halfling shows up in Cirith Ungol and mysteriously escapes. You'd think that more than the sniffer and warrior orc would have been looking for them. The only possible explanation is that Sauron assumed that Saruman had wrested the Ring from Pippin (Sauron thinking that it was in fact the Baggins he was looking for) and that the fall of Orthanc meant that Aragorn had the Ring. Still, you'd think a more thorough search would have been underway. Of course, maybe there was a more thorough search, and Frodo and Samwise avoided it so thoroughly that Frodo never knew to write about it. (Remember Tolkien has Frodo has the actual author of the book that became _The Lord of the Rings_.) But that's reading a bit far into the fallible narrator thesis.


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## Ithrynluin (Feb 20, 2004)

I voted for 



> _Aragorns only armament being a broken sword while at Bree..._


even though I don't think that's a huge flaw, if it can in fact even be called a flaw. Is it a matter of fact that Aragorn was defensless at that point?

The other options I don't consider flaws at all. As has been said, they can all be explained with perfectly good reasoning and common sense.


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## Starflower (Feb 20, 2004)

at the time when Frodo's chainmail appears at the Gate, they think a) that he is all alone and b)that he is still captive at the Tower of Cirith Ungol. 
Remember, they only captured Frodo, not Sam, and the orcs thoguht Sam was 'a fierce elven warrior'.. so there was no feasible reason for Sauron to search Mordor for halflings.


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## grendel (Feb 22, 2004)

How about Gandalf entrusting a letter to Butterbur, which of course never makes it to Hobbitton... what was he thinking? It delayed Frodo for months, if I'm remembering right. This guy was an Istari, one of the wisest men of his time... ??


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## Bucky (Feb 22, 2004)

This has got to be one of the dumbest polls EVER.


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## Iluvatar (Feb 23, 2004)

Bucky said:


> This has got to be one of the dumbest polls EVER.



Definitely one of the dumbest posts.


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## pgt (Feb 23, 2004)

Here's a few more...

There are NUMEROUS problems w/ the death march of course. (I should know!) - the Death March and the convenient eagles thing are pretty much the toss up for me.

The Cottons meteoric if late rise to fame and influence in the Hobbiton area where previously they seem to be virtually non-existent in all those detailed early chapters on trivial details and insights into Shire life.

How about Sauron's silly 'rule' that prevented the winged Nazgul from flying across the river for a while... Why not? I guess it would have been rather inconvenient to have the winged 9 harassing the boats as they cruised down river.

What about Gandalf's staff from his imprisonment at Orthanc (or am I confusing the movie again?)

I don't think Frodo ever even wore the ring until Bree then Weathertop (though that's never made absolutely clear) yet he falls more completely under it's influence despite Gandalf's warning to use it sparingly or not at all. Bilbo? He wore quite often for the most trivial of reasons over the course of decades yet he walked away. 

Glorfindels notable absence when the Northern Dunedain and Elrohir and Eladan show up is inexplicable. His absence later was glaring.

--

While I imagine some are apt to complain about this topic - obviously all the folks here enjoyed the books immensely - the massive scope, complexity and thoroughness invites such 'scrutiny' and ultimate opinions as to flaws. They dont' take away from the richness of the story one bit - indeed the entire premise is fantasy and requires suspended disbelief. In fact what is surprising is that there are not many many more quirks than those listed given this was the work of a single person w/o the aid of computers. 

(And FWIW I also enjoyed chuckling at the Lampoon version - 'Bored w/ the Rings' years ago - wish I still had that one)


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## simbelmyne (Feb 25, 2004)

I voted for the eagles...it was great moment in the book, but the whole rescue leaves you wondering...why didn't Gandalf, Radagast, etc. arrange with the eagles beforehand to fly Frodo over Mount Doom and then he could have simply dropped the ring in? 

I was also disappointed that Faramir is barely mentioned after he lets Aragorn into the city. He was a major character, and he never even said goodbye, nor are there even any words exchanged with Pippin, who saved his life.


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## Ithrynluin (Feb 26, 2004)

> I voted for the eagles...it was great moment in the book, but the whole rescue leaves you wondering...why didn't Gandalf, Radagast, etc. arrange with the eagles beforehand to fly Frodo over Mount Doom and then he could have simply dropped the ring in?


Because that's not the way things work in Arda.  



> _The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien; #210_
> The Eagles are a dangerous 'machine'. I have used them sparingly, and that is the absolute limit of their credibility or usefulness. The alighting of a Great Eagle of the Misty Mountains in the Shire is absurd; it also makes the later capture of G. by Saruman incredible, and spoils the account of his escape. (One of Z's chief faults is his tendency to anticipate scenes or devices used later, thereby flattening the tale out.) _Radagast_ is not an Eagle-name, but a wizard's name; several eagle-names are supplied in the book. These points are to me important.
> ...
> At the bottom of the page, the Eagles are again introduced. _I feel this to be a wholly unacceptable tampering with the tale._ 'Nine Walkers' and they immediately go up in the air! The intrusion achieves nothing but incredibility, and the staling of the device of the Eagles when at last they are really needed. It is well within the powers of pictures to suggest, relatively briefly, a long and arduous journey, _in secrecy,_ on foot, with the three ominous mountains getting nearer.


The Eagles pop up only at the most crucial of moments. They are not there to do the work instead of the people of M-E. If it were so, then Manwë could have simply organized the War of Wrath as soon as Melkor destroyed the Trees, and so he could have uprooted evil at the relative beginning.


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## Lantarion (Feb 26, 2004)

Grond said:


> I chose none of the above because I am a true and loyal Tolkien fan.


Are you saying that only people who turn a blind eye to rather substantial flaws in the story are considered true and loyal fans? Now personally I feel that, in the actual context of the book, these points are quite meaningless; but some of them I do recognize as rather glaring, and one would be in denial if they tried to invent excuses for something as idiotic as two Hobbits posing successfully as Orcs.  I mean I would personally claim that there were hundreds of Orcs in that single group alone, and that two specific ones would not be bothered about; but it does seem pretty convenient. And Gandalf, being the wisest of all Maiar as said in the Silmarillion, didn't work out the nature of the Ring for years and years!! Indeed for decades!

But I do think that the tale is one of such unbelievable beauty, complexity, heroism, loyalty and mystery that these points do not, as I said, pose a real threat for somebody who truly enjoys this titanic work of fiction. So perhaps in that sense you have a point Grond; but it seems rather cruel to say that somebody who finds these seeming plot 'flaws' nagging could not be considered a Tolkien fan.


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## Grond (Feb 26, 2004)

Lantarion said:


> Are you saying that only people who turn a blind eye to rather substantial flaws in the story are considered true and loyal fans? Now personally I feel that, in the actual context of the book, these points are quite meaningless; but some of them I do recognize as rather glaring, and one would be in denial if they tried to invent excuses for something as idiotic as two Hobbits posing successfully as Orcs.  I mean I would personally claim that there were hundreds of Orcs in that single group alone, and that two specific ones would not be bothered about; but it does seem pretty convenient. And Gandalf, being the wisest of all Maiar as said in the Silmarillion, didn't work out the nature of the Ring for years and years!! Indeed for decades!
> 
> But I do think that the tale is one of such unbelievable beauty, complexity, heroism, loyalty and mystery that these points do not, as I said, pose a real threat for somebody who truly enjoys this titanic work of fiction. So perhaps in that sense you have a point Grond; but it seems rather cruel to say that somebody who finds these seeming plot 'flaws' nagging could not be considered a Tolkien fan.


I choose to enjoy the author's intent and don't dwell on any "minor inconsistencies" of the story. After all, it is a fictional story. One that is well written and well thought out but one that is not based on the physics of our own world. It's not even based on a consistent theory of physics... look at Tolkiens various approaches to handle flat earth versus round earth (another discussion in itself). 

I chose none of the above because the overall beauty of the works far outway any minor errors of "logic". After all, it is a fairy tale, a mythology, a world that I want to live in but will never be able to do so.


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## Ol'gaffer (Feb 27, 2004)

aragil said:


> I don't know about the 'Hobbit's as Orcs' thing. I mean, it seems like as often as not good folks are worried about being mistaken for Orcs. Eomer almost mistakes Aragorn and co. for Orcs, Merry and Pippin are worried about being mistaken for Orcs by Eomer, and Treebeard says he would have taken Merry and Pippin to be Orcs if he hadn't first heard their voices. Perhaps Orcs weren't really supposed to look as different as artists' conceptions would lead us to believe. I mean, Frodo and Sam deliberately took Orc gear so that they would look like Orcs, so there must have been (built into the novels at that point) some possibility for the disguise to work, otherwise why bother with the Orc-gear? It's not like it felt good on the skin, or made their journey any quicker.



So maybe Orcs actually looked like hobbits. 

Think about the confusion in the Shire if that were true 

Merry: Hullo Frodo
Orc: I ain't frodo ye pint sized pipsquek! I is mordor orc!
Merry: well, wear a name tag or something!



Sorry, it's late.


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## Elfarmari (Feb 28, 2004)

pgt said:


> I don't think Frodo ever even wore the ring until Bree then Weathertop (though that's never made absolutely clear) yet he falls more completely under it's influence despite Gandalf's warning to use it sparingly or not at all. Bilbo? He wore quite often for the most trivial of reasons over the course of decades yet he walked away.


Sauron was gradually gaining strength throughout the time that Bilbo held the Ring. Because Bilbo used it only for trivial things, with no ill intent at all, this also protected him somewhat from its influence. Bilbo never encountered Ringwraiths, for instance. Frodo did not use the Ring very often, but Sauron was much more powerful than he had been, and was growing stronger. He was now exerting all his will-power to reach the Ring and return it to himself. This, I think, is why Bilbo escaped the hold of the Ring while Frodo could not.



pgt said:


> Glorfindels notable absence when the Northern Dunedain and Elrohir and Eladan show up is inexplicable. His absence later was glaring.


I've always assumed that Glorfindel would have aided in the battles against Sauron's armies that occured outside of Gondor and Morder (Lothlorien, Dale, I can't remember anywhere else. . .).


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## Helcaraxë (Feb 28, 2004)

pgt said:


> Indeed the entire premise is fantasy and requires suspended disbelief.



Tsk tsk. Remember "On Fairy Stories"? It's not suspended disbelief, but seconday belief.


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## Bucky (Feb 29, 2004)

_Originally Posted by Bucky
This has got to be one of the dumbest polls EVER. 


Definitely one of the dumbest posts._

OK, I'll explain in detail why it's a dumb poll.......

'Which flaw MOST ruins the story?'...

Asked like this is some site where everyone comes to complain about what a crummy peice a literature _The Lord Of The Rngs_ is as opposed to the great work which we all love.
Then, the poll proceeds to nit-pick through the book like there are _numerous_ problems that just make it a big mess that is garbage......

'most ruins'

Absurd.

Now, that's why I said "This is one of the dunbest polls ever"

I stand by that statement.


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## elf_queen (Feb 29, 2004)

I don't think it ruined the story, indeed, it was crucial to the plot, but I don't get how Gandalf didn't know about the balrog. I mean, if I have my dates right, he was THERE when the dwarves left Moria. 

*on the other hand, I probably don't have my dates right*


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## Bucky (Feb 29, 2004)

_but I don't get how Gandalf didn't know about the balrog. I mean, if I have my dates right, he was THERE when the dwarves left Moria. _

Most likely, no Dwarf came in close contact with Durin's Bane & lived to give a good description.
Remember "There are older & fouler things than orcs in the deep places of the earth."

It's likey that the Wise just knew that the Dwarves unleashed some sort of ancient monster & that's it.......


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## Grond (Feb 29, 2004)

Bucky said:


> Most likely, no Dwarf came in close contact with Durin's Bane & lived to give a good description.
> Remember "There are older & fouler things than orcs in the deep places of the earth."
> 
> It's likey that the Wise just knew that the Dwarves unleashed some sort of ancient monster & that's it.......


My thoughts exactamundo. They could easily have thougth it was some creature akin to the Watcher in the Water.


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## Saucy (Feb 29, 2004)

i said the eagles caus ei fthe eagles ACTUALLY wanted to be useful, there are so many places they could of helped out, lets see helms deep, getting the ring to mordor, the list goes on and on!


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## Eledhwen (Feb 29, 2004)

First, thanks to Grond for adding an option I felt comfortable voting in.

As for the above comments, Gandalf did not immediately recognise Thrain son of Thror in Dol Guldur, even with the map and key. He may have been in Middle-earth, but he is not omnipresent or omniscient - there was a lot he did not know.

On suspended disbelief: For me, Tolkien's craft was beyond this concept. Whilst reading, I simply _believed_. I like Tolkien's definition of 'secondary belief'. Finishing the book for the first time was almost like a bereavement. I was so wrapped up in the story it was like I was leaving Middle-earth myself.


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## chipset (Mar 11, 2004)

As for Aragorn choosing to go after Merry and Pippin instead of following Frodo and Sam - how could he and Gimli and Legolas have helped the ring-bearer? I mean if we look at Frodo's journey, there isn't really anywhere that they could have been of assitance; five would have been easier to spot in Mordor, and five could certainly not have assailed the Black Gate.
Going after Merry and Pippin was the logical choice, because they were in immediate danger - remember Aragorn had no way of knowing that Eomer would meet the uruks and slay them, or that Gandalf was back again and roaming wild in Fangorn, or for that matter that Merry and Pippin would end up in Fangorn. It was in the spirit of the Fellowship to follow those who were taken captive, rather than pursuing those who had chosen their own path. It is probably what Gandalf would have done too.

The orcs not noticing that Frodo and Sam were hobbits is a bit odd, but keep in mind - darkness, disguise (be it unconvincing) and the great many that were about the place. Also, I'm sure it never corssed the orcs' minds that there was any chance for halflings to try to pretend to be orcs and follow the host.


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## Greenwood (Mar 11, 2004)

chipset,

You make good points. I would add that for Aragorn and the others to have followed Frodo and Sam would have meant forcing themselves on Frodo when he clearly did not want them to come. There is the additional question of what would Frodo's reaction have been after Aragorn appeared and Frodo asked: "Where are Merry and Pippin?" and Aragorn responds: "Oh, the orcs carried them off. We didn't try to rescue them." Given that Frodo had only escaped Boromir's attempt on him by using the Ring I think it is not unreasonable to think Frodo might have thought that abandoning Merry and Pippin to the orcs was merely due to the evil influence and lure of the Ring.

Additionally, any hope the quest has lies with Sauron (and Saruman) remaining blind to Frodo's goal -- to destroy the Ring. Frodo and Sam are free and are pursuing that goal. Merry and Pippin, who are privy to the secret are captive and being taken straight to Saruman (or worse Sauron) and they will certainly reveal all they know. That is a definite, immediate danger. Finally, abandoning Merry and Pippin to the orcs would be a betrayal of the Fellowship and friendship. In Tolkien's Middle Earth such a betrayal would certainly have dire consequences. Being true to their friends and Fellowship will almost certainly be rewarded.


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## Ireth Telrúnya (Mar 11, 2004)

I was just reading this and there's Sam walking around Mordor with the Ring on his finger and Sauron is unable to see him? Since I believe I understood it right that Sauron easily spotted those who had the Ring on their finger...and Sam's not seen by him at all...

I also thought when I was reading this again..(I noticed I didn't remember almost nothing from the first time I read the book)...the Mouth of Sauron was not in the movie...or the Black Rider other than the Ringwraiths..maybe they would have explained the entity of Sauron a bit more. Him being just a great Eye suspended in the air between two towers was really a bit silly. He was a ghost without form and only one part of him was the Eye. At least this is what I understand he is..


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## Greenwood (Mar 11, 2004)

Ireth Telrúnya said:


> I was just reading this and there's Sam walking around Mordor with the Ring on his finger and Sauron is unable to see him? Since I believe I understood it right that Sauron easily spotted those who had the Ring on their finger...and Sam's not seen by him at all...



You have to distinguish between the movies and the books. In the books there is no indication that Sauron is automatically aware of someone wearing the Ring. (If he was he would have been aware of Bilbo wearing it in the Shire on all the times he used it to avoid the Sackville-Baggins and long since recovered it; end of story.) In fact in the books Sauron is only aware of anyone wearing the Ring on just two occasions and they are both in special circumstances. The first is when Frodo wears the Ring while he is sitting in the Seat of Seeing at Amon Hen. This is clearly a special place (we can assume this by its very name). Sauron is unaware of Frodo when he puts on the Ring to escape Boromir and only seems to become aware of him when Frodo is in the Seat of Seeing and looks towards Barad-dur. Even then Sauron's awareness seems to only be a vague sense of direction and we are given the impression that Sauron is searching in Frodo's direction, first looking at Amon Lhaw, but then missing Frodo on Amon Hen when Frodo removes the Ring.

The second time Sauron is aware of Frodo wearing the Ring is when Frodo puts it on at the Cracks of Doom (the place of the Ring's forging) and even more importantly Frodo claims the Ring for his own. It is not surprising that Frodo claiming the Ring at that place would make Sauron instantly aware of him. On all the other occasions that Frodo (or Bilbo) or Sam wear the Ring, in the books, there is no indication that Sauron is aware of them. 

One final minor point, Sam never wears the Ring *in* Mordor. He wears it in the Pass of Cirith Ungol before entering Mordor.


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## Ireth Telrúnya (Mar 12, 2004)

Actually I suspected this a bit when I was writing the previous entry. 
Anyway I thought that since in the book there was this description that Frodo could see the Ringwraiths and they could see Frodo much better once he put the Ring on at Weathertop, I thought that this also meant Sauron, since he's also a ghost like the Ringwraiths.
And you're right, Sam had not yet entered Mordor when he wore the Ring. I just read on last night. 
And I noticed that one thing Sam says had been switched into a scene that was not in the movie, and that's Sam's suggestion of sharing the burden with Frodo when he's about to give the Ring back to him but obviously hesitates because of the Ring's power.
In the movie it was quite much altered since Gollum had spoken to Frodo that Sam would want to steal the Ring and therefore Frodo sent Sam back home.

And in the book Frodo did call Sam a thief, but he immediately apologized to him of his behavior and blamed it on the Ring.

Now I'll take a couple of weeks break from this forum and this computer, but I'll be back!!


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## Inderjit S (Mar 12, 2004)

I suppose it would have to be Sauron not searching for Frodo and Sam in Mordor. But given that he thought one of the captains had the ring, such a search would have been futile, plus he had a lot more on his mind. The perceived aggression of Gondor etc. and their march to Mordor seems to convince him that they were marching to Mordor with the ring. Plus the prisoner had been thoroughly searched and stripped and no ring was found. 

But he really should have sent more spies or scouts out to waylay the company; but as Gandalf tells Aragorn Sauron must suffer from being labelled the oxymoronic ‘wise fool’.


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## chipset (Mar 12, 2004)

Ireth Telrúnya said:


> He was a ghost without form and only one part of him was the Eye. At least this is what I understand he is..


Don't let the movies fool you! Sauron does have physical form, this is stated by both Tolkien in at least one of his letters as well as by Gollum in The Two Towers. Tolkien also says in one of his letters that no mortals (and few immortals) could withold the Ring from Sauron in his presence. It would be quite hard for an eye to take a Ring from someone.
Moreover, what good would the Ring be to the Dark Lord if he couldn't wear it? He couldn't very well have worn it on his eye! If I am correct, Tolkien describes Sauron as having a shape somewhat larger than that of a man.


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## Restless (Mar 19, 2004)

*Another plot flaw*

This thread seems to have died but I'm hoping to revive it ;-)

None of you mentioned the one that gets me the most: why they waited weeks at Rivendell for the scouts to come back. It just meant it was deepest darkest winter and the ringwraiths had all that time to get back to Sauron. What were they going to do if the scouts found the wraiths? Change their plans?? Tolkien carefully established that they had no choice! - and the presence of the ringwraiths later didn't have a lot of effect on the ringbearer anyway.


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## Ireth Telrúnya (Mar 19, 2004)

Okay, so I suppose Sauron was a larger version of a Ringwraith. I do remember something like that in the book. 
Maybe he also could have taken any form he liked since he was a wizard.


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## Barliman Butterbur (Mar 19, 2004)

Goro Shimura said:


> Okay... which one was the straw the broke the Camel's back?



I suggest you take these matters up with Tolkien — after all, the book is exactly the way he wanted it to be, judging by his Intro to LOTR and the contents of his letters...  

Lotho


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## Eledhwen (Mar 19, 2004)

I think that once a Maia had taken a shape, they could either stick with it or leave it, but they were not shape-shifters like, say, Beorn (a man). Also, Sauron was not one of the Istari. He was a Maia, for sure, but of what order I don't think we are told, other than that he learned his craft under Aule, then Morgoth - presumably the smithying from Aule and the witchcraft from Morgoth.

I also read somewhere that, once arrayed in flesh, the Maiar became 'attached' to their bodily form, protective of it, and could not readily discard it.


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