# The greatest man in ME?



## Ithrynluin (Jun 29, 2002)

Who is it & why?
I think it's Beren.


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## Niniel (Jun 29, 2002)

I voted for Hurin. I always liked him, he seems both ehroic (when he defies Morgoth) and a very nice man (the way he treats his wife and son). Maybe he was not such a great warrior as Turin, but I never liked Turin that much, he is too violent and moody for my taste. Whereas Beren he looks more like an Elf, so Hurin would be my man!


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## Galdor (Jun 29, 2002)

I'd have to say Elendil. I mean how many people had the courage to fight Souron himself.


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## Khamul (Jun 29, 2002)

Hurin no question. He directly defied Morgoth, the most powerful of the Valar.


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## Chymaera (Jun 30, 2002)

I vote for Aragorn. He had to do a lot of hard work just to get to a point where he could claim the crown. Then he had to spend the rest of his life consolidating his power. 
He might not measure up to Beren and Hurin, but on this list Aragorn should come in third.


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## Gil-Galad (Jul 1, 2002)

ithrynluin,we are on different opinions.I think the greatest man is Hurin.He is the only one who stays in front of Morgoth and never said where Gondolin was.He saw Turin's fate but didn't confess where Gondolin was.I think that's really great.


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## Tyaronumen (Jul 1, 2002)

Surprised that Earendil wasn't a choice -- but I picked Beren because he pried a Silmaril from Morgoth's crown... if that isn't great, what is?


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## Ithrynluin (Jul 1, 2002)

I was uncertain whether to include Eärendil in the poll.
But Eärendil,being Half-elven,chose to be regarded as one of the Firstborn-for Elwing's sake.But his heart was rather with the Edain.
Well,he chose to "be an elf" so that dissuaded me from including him.


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## Mormegil (Jul 2, 2002)

Turiin was the greatest man in ME. His life was doomed from the start, yet he tried his best and never gave up battling against the evils of Morgoth. And killing a Dragon is no easy task.

I am dissuaded from choosing Beren because he had the help of a half Elf/Maia. Whereas Turin had no such help.


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## Tyaronumen (Jul 2, 2002)

Yes, and see how well Turin did? *snort*


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## elf boy (Jul 2, 2002)

I say it's Beren. The guy went right into the heart of Morgoth's domain seeking the Silmarils, even after he had already been caught once, and nearly killed! (quite a bit of courage there) He cut a silmaril from Morgoth's crown and managed to escape even after losing a hand to Carcharoth.


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## Londier (Jul 2, 2002)

Its a tough choice between Aragorn, Beren, and Hurin. All three men proved very brave, so I can't really answer upon what they did, but I can on what they did it for. I think Aragorn should be #1 because he did all that stuff for the future of ME and to destroy the darkness of sauron. Hurin would be #2 because of the Melkor thing, he saved many people in Gondolin, even though eventually it was destroyed. And finally Beren, yes he did get a silmaril from melkor, but he only did it for Luthien and not for anyone else. All in all, they are all great.


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## GrrPuppy (Jul 4, 2002)

"Last of all Hurin stood alone. Then he cast aside his shield, and weilded an axe two-handed; and it is sung that the axe smoked in the black blood of the troll-gaurd of Gothmog until it withered, and each time he slew Hurin cried: '_Aure entuluva!_ Day shall come again!' Seventy times he uttered that cry."


*Seventy!* 

Hurin wins.

Grr


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## Gil-Galad (Jul 4, 2002)

hey people jsut think if it wasn't Luthien,Beren would do such things.While Hurin,Turin,Huor,Elendil and Aragorn have done so many great things without any help.I'm just wonderin what Beren would have done if it wasnt' Luthien.


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## Mormegil (Jul 4, 2002)

Exactly my thoughts Gil-Galad,
Perhaps Beren is the 'greatest man with help from an Elf-witch'
I think that Hurin, Turin, and Aragorn were greater men than Beren.



> Yes, and see how well Turin did? *snort*


Well, he did kill the father of all dragons, and gets to kill Melkor at the end of the world. So, I would say that Turin did quite well.


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## Camille (Jul 4, 2002)

Hurin without doubt is the greatest!!! he sacrificed himself to allow Turgon escaped, and his actitude with Melkor was great!


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## Niniel (Jul 5, 2002)

Exactly! What he said to Morgoth:


> 'Blind you are, Morgoth Bauglir, and blind shall ever be, seeing only in the dark. You know not what rules the hearts of Men, and if you knew you could not give it.'





> 'You are not the Lord of Men, and shall not be, though all Arda and Menel fall in your dominion. Beyond the Circles of the World you shall not pursue those who refuse you.'


So: Húrin all the way!


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## Tyaronumen (Jul 5, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Mormegil _
> *Exactly my thoughts Gil-Galad,
> Perhaps Beren is the 'greatest man with help from an Elf-witch'
> I think that Hurin, Turin, and Aragorn were greater men than Beren.
> ...



The world hasn't ended yet, so that part doesn't count -- and besides, he did an incredible amount of crappy stuff too, unlike some of his contemporaries with a bit more class (who, granted, were not cursed by Morgoth. )


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## ¤-Elessar-¤ (Jul 5, 2002)

Hurin also... Basicly for reasons already stated. He laid to waist the troll guard of Gothmog, saved the life of Turgon, and thus giving hope to the elven and the elf-friends for yet a little while longer. And he never broke in the face of Melkor, in fact, I beleive he insulted Morgoth to his face. He was made to sit and watch as every member of his family's life was destroyed. He watched as his lands and people were usurped by the fell easterlings. And he finnaly made it back to his wife, Morwen the beautiful, and was the last man to stand upon the hill of Tol-Morwen.


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## Pippin (Jul 5, 2002)

I can´t believe Turin is as far as he is now. Come on people that thins he did were increible, no man in ME have done as much as he.

Some might say that Beren is greater, because he did take the Silmaril out of Morgoth Crown, but let´s face it, he did have help from Luthien.

So for me Turin Turambar should´ve been first.


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## Mormegil (Jul 5, 2002)

Wahoo!!
The Turin campaign gains some support.  



> The world hasn't ended yet, so that part doesn't count


It's part of Tolkien's universe so it does count. Admit it, Turin acheives the greatest deed of all time, finally defeating the greatest entity ever to enter Arda.
Tolkien says it happens, so I think I can sit content in my opinion of Turin Turambar as the greatest man in ME.


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## Ithrynluin (Jul 6, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Pippin _
> *
> Some might say that Beren is greater, because he did take the Silmaril out of Morgoth Crown, but let´s face it, he did have help from Luthien.
> *



Of course he had help from Luthien;one would require exceptional help from an elf-maia for such a task as going to the very pits of Angband and wrestling the Silmaril from Morgoth's crown. Are Beren's deeds made less because he did it for love-remeber,were it not for their love,poor would the later history of ME be.There would be no Aragorn and no Arwen,no Numenorean kings,no Eärendil to plead to the Valar. Surely trhe world would end in Sauron's darkness without these individuals.

And BTW,I don't think that Turin killing Morgoth in the end really counts as "one of his great deeds".We only know he kills him in the end,we know nothing of the circumstances surrounding it or the help he might get.For all we know,he might only be the person to deal Morgoth "the final,deadly blow" when others might do the hard work prior to that.


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## Camille (Jul 6, 2002)

> I can´t believe Turin is as far as he is now. Come on people that thins he did were increible, no man in ME have done as much as he.


I live Turin, I think he was powerfull, brave, etc etc, but his father was greatest, Turin was defeated while his father endure evil.


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## Rúmil (Jul 6, 2002)

Húrin was defeated in the same way as his son in the end... he unwittingly showed Morgoth where Gondolin was, and was thus the primary cause fo the fall of the greatest elven-kigndom in Beleriand. No, I think Mandos wouldn't have appointed Túrin to be the bane of Melkor at the end of Time if he wasn't the greatest Man ever. (HOMEvol5, Quenta Silmarillion, at the very end) Beren would be the second, IMO? and Húrin the third.


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## ¤-Elessar-¤ (Jul 6, 2002)

Yes, but were it not for the revealing of Gondolin there would never had been the Numenorians, and there would never had been any might strong enough to overthrow Sauron in the third age. If Gondolin had not fallen Elrond and Elros would had been born under completely different circumstances. Elros would have been brought up in Gondolin, instead of near the sea and his father's kin. He would have not chosen to be mortal, and the Elf-friends (already in small numbers) would have dwindled away to nothing throughout the second age. Therefor, Hurin inadvertently gave an opening for the greatest hope of the world to be born, the might of Numenore.


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## Rúmil (Jul 6, 2002)

I agree totally with you Elessar; the point I was trying to make was just that not doing the works of Evil involuntarily could not be a factor to distinguish Húrin from Túrin as they both did so.


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## elf boy (Jul 7, 2002)

i agree that Beren did what he did for Luthien, but even getting to where he found Luthien was a great feat. And even though he did it for Luthien, how many people would go into angband twice, after being caught the first time, and taking a Silmaril from Morgoth's crown, and live to get out again?


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## Phenix (Jul 9, 2002)

I think beren is the greatest man in ME couse he went down in to Morgoth's lair and stealed a silmarillion

is it "a silmarilion" or a" silmarill"


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## Rúmil (Jul 9, 2002)

It is a "silmaril", a quenya word, with a nominal derivation -ril from the root "sil" "glowing, radience", which refers to the jewels designed by Fëanor. "Silmarillion" is the name of the book about them; it is a plural subjective (i.e., not possessive) genitive and means "of, concerning the Silmarils.


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## Phenix (Jul 10, 2002)

thanks.


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## Rúmil (Jul 10, 2002)

any time


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## Ithrynluin (Sep 14, 2002)

I've dragged this up for the new folks on the forum,to see what they think!
I'm shocked that some of these mightiest of the Edain don't even have a single vote!


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## gate7ole (Sep 14, 2002)

Tuor. He was after all Earendil's father.


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## Ithrynluin (Sep 14, 2002)

> _Originally posted by gate7ole _
> *Tuor. He was after all Earendil's father. *



1.I am glad that someone finally chose Tuor! He was truly mighty!
2.I don't really agree with your reason why Tuor was great. 
3.Why is your vote not reflected on the poll?


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## Gil-Galad (Sep 14, 2002)

hm,If I had to chose Tuor I would chose it becasue he saves many elves from Gondolin,because he's the only one who meets a Vala,but not because he's Earendil's father.Then I will say that Huor is the greatest because he's Tuor's father.


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## gate7ole (Sep 17, 2002)

I chose Tuor because I admire Earendil. He was the savior of the wolrd, the one who united the two races and gained the pardon from the Valar. But as Earendil is considered an elf, I chose his closest relative, his father Tuor. Not that Tuor himself was not a great man. But his son was his greatest achievement


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## Confusticated (Sep 18, 2002)

I can not vote with this browser. I choose Hurin though, and I see that a lot of other people have too. I choose him for the same reasos that they have.
I will add that i think Hurin would have done well as any of those other men if he were put in their positions.


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## Gil-Galad (Sep 20, 2002)

> _Originally posted by gate7ole _
> *I chose Tuor because I admire Earendil. He was the savior of the wolrd, the one who united the two races and gained the pardon from the Valar. But as Earendil is considered an elf, I chose his closest relative, his father Tuor. Not that Tuor himself was not a great man. But his son was his greatest achievement *


If i were you I would vote for Huor cause he is Earendil's grandfather...


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## ApplCobbler (Sep 20, 2002)

My vote goes to Turin. Because he's the one who gets to correct The Music Of The Ainur.


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## Gil-Galad (Sep 28, 2002)

> _Originally posted by ithrynluin _
> *LOL *


Even Galdor,the father of Hour would be the greatest man in ME.


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## *Lady Arwen* (Oct 28, 2002)

I voted for Aragorn


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## Ithrynluin (Oct 29, 2002)

> _Originally posted by *Lady Arwen* _
> *I voted for Aragorn *



And why is that, *Lady Arwen* ?


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## Ramagna (Oct 30, 2002)

I voted Turin, cause he's as well the most sad one..
he can't prevent his doom but doesn't give up...


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## Eriol (Oct 31, 2002)

Tough choice, but in the end Aragorn, The Renewer, Elfstone, the guy who worked for some 60 years without any recognition and without much hope but did what he had to do anyway wins. Picture his life: disguised in the service of Thengel, Théoden's father, then in the service of Echtelion II of Gondor, running risk after risk to preserve the chances of the West. Gandalf named him "the greatest traveller of our age", and he did it most of the time alone, in foreign lands. And, the joy of the achievement of his life, against all reasonable hope, and of his marriage... Aragorn definitely.


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## Gil-Galad (Nov 2, 2002)

> _Originally posted by ithrynluin _
> *And why is that, Lady Arwen ? *


Ooo let me guess!If I'm correct,will I win any prize?!


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## Ithrynluin (Nov 2, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Gil-Galad _
> *Ooo let me guess!If I'm correct,will I win any prize?!  *



Of course you get a prize! The newest book called "Why Fëanor could never qualify for the title of the greatest elf ever". But that really has to do with another thread. Have fun reading it though.


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## Gil-Galad (Nov 2, 2002)

> _Originally posted by ithrynluin _
> *Of course you get a prize! The newest book called "Why Fëanor could never qualify for the title of the greatest elf ever". But that really has to do with another thread. Have fun reading it though. *


WOW!You mean:Why Fëanor qualify for the title of the greatest elf ever".You're so polite ithrynluin!!!!


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## tom_bombadil (Nov 15, 2002)

You know im going to say bombadil


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## Gil-Galad (Nov 15, 2002)

> _Originally posted by tom_bombadil _
> *You know im going to say bombadil *


Are you sure Tom Bombadil is a man? As I can remember we have had a log discusion about Tom and we haven't clearified his status yet.I mean we don' tknow what kind of creature is he.But he is not a man.


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## Curufinwe (Nov 16, 2002)

*Tuor*

Ohh cmon people, Tuor was the greatest , of course he didnt get enough attention and wasnt portrayed as a huge hero like his cousin but still his legend lives on as he was the first man ever see Ulmo.


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## Aragorns_girl00 (Dec 27, 2002)

*omg*

ARAGORN IS HANDS DOWN!!!! HE'S THE KING!!!!!!!!!! and he's a hottie.....


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## *Lady Aragorn* (Jan 1, 2003)

*Re: omg*



> _Originally posted by Aragorns_girl00 _
> *ARAGORN IS HANDS DOWN!!!! HE'S THE KING!!!!!!!!!! and he's a hottie..... *



yep, you're right! he is also very herioc (sp)!


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## Beleg (May 16, 2003)

Erm, Hurin, No Doubt about it. And, I see that None has even mentioned Beren singular feat of passing through Ered Gorgoth alive. That was a feat achieved by no other man or elf. Most people tend to look at Beren from the Silmaril prespective. He showed great skills as he defined Morgoth's creatures for Three years in high Mountains. The price on his head concided with that on Fingon's head. The man should have had some Valour in himself.
Although I am not a Beren Lover, i think that these things should also be brought into consideration if you are thinking of voting. 
Why I haven't voted for him is becuase I don't think that he would have been able to defy Morgoth, face-to-face, for long. 
I have always felt that his attitude towards the great people was a tad too submissive, as shown in his meeting with Thingol and his anxiety while cuting the Silmaril from Melkor's crown.


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## Ithrynluin (May 17, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Beleg_strongbow _
> *
> I have always felt that his attitude towards the great people was a tad too submissive, as shown in his meeting with Thingol and his anxiety while cuting the Silmaril from Melkor's crown. *



Don't you think that humility is a personality trait, not a flaw? He did stand up to Thingol when his family was insulted:



> _From 'Of Beren and Luthien'_
> Then silence fell upon the hall, for those that stood there were astounded and afraid, and they thought that Beren would be slain. But Thingol spoke slowly, saying: 'Death you have earned with these words; and death you should find suddenly, had I not sworn an oath in haste; of which I repent, baseborn mortal, who in the realm of Morgoth has learnt to creep in secret as his spies and thralls.'
> Then Beren answered: 'Death you can give me earned or unearned; but the names I will not take from you of baseborn, nor spy, nor thrall. By the ring of Felagund, that he gave to Barahir my father on the battle field of the North, my house has not earned such names from any Elf, be he king or no.'
> His words were proud, and all eyes looked upon the ring; for he held it now aloft, and the green jewels gleamed there that the Noldor had devised in Valinor. For this ring was like to twin serpents, whose eyes were emeralds, and their heads met beneath a crown of golden flowers, that the one upheld and the other devoured; that was the badge of Finarfin and his house; Then Melian leaned to Thingol's side, and in whispered counsel bade him forgo his wrath. 'For not by you,' she said, 'shall Beren be slain; and far and free does his fate led him in the end, yet it is wound with yours. Take heed!'



Perhaps if he had been over confident or arrogant in Thingol's presence, he would have been imprisoned...and that would not be good.


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## Elf-Archer755 (May 18, 2003)

I voted for Beren!!


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## Jesse (May 19, 2003)

I picked Aragorn. The reason is he is the descendant of the King and he overthrew Sauron in RotK.


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## Lantarion (May 20, 2003)

> The reason is he is the descendant of the King and he overthrew Sauron in RotK


*cough* *cough* *wheeze*
What about that little thing called the Fellowship of the Ring? Or Frodo, remember the guy who actually threw the RIng into the Sammath Naur and thus destroyed Sauron's physical being forever?? 

I voted for Húrin or Beren, can't remember which.


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## Helcaraxë (May 21, 2003)

My vote would be with Aragorn. Beren and Hurin and company may have defied sauron/morgoth, but so did aragorn/w the palantir. He was certainly the greatest ranger in history, and because of his strength of will, and skills, was probably also the greatest human. Just a thought.


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## Manveru (Jun 14, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Galdor:_
> *I'd have to say Elendil. I mean how many people had the courage to fight Souron himself.*


True, I agree with that Galdor. But what other man dared to stand before Morgoth, the Black Enemy of the World, himself? What's more...and come out of Angband alive?
My choice was simple...
I voted Beren Erchamion


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## Manveru (Jun 14, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Lantarion:_
> *What about that little thing called the Fellowship of the Ring? Or Frodo, remember the guy who actually threw the RIng into the Sammath Naur and thus destroyed Sauron's physical being forever??*


As I remember Frodo didn't want to destroy the One Ring. He put IT on and claimed new 'Lord of the Rings' (I guess-I cannot check the book at this time, but I will). It was Gollum who, how to say this, 'destroyed' the Ring --> he bit IT off along with Frodo's finger and then fell into the fiery pit...
But it's not the topic of this thread. Sorry for my little digression...


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## Adûnâi (Jul 1, 2015)

Sorry for necro, but in 13 years somebody should have cast their vote for the King of Arda Ar-Pharazôn the Golden who took on the very land of Ainur! He also managed to cause a gigantic wave that destroyed his kingdom and entire western shore of Middle-earth.


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## Silevon (Jul 19, 2016)

There is one man who is prophesied to deliver the killing blow to Morgoth himself in the Dagor Dagorath, and that would be Turin.


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## CirdanLinweilin (Jul 20, 2016)

I voted for Hurin for basically insulting Satan to his face, but I got to give props to Aragorn. I don't know, he just seemed the most...human and down to earth to me. And I don't know how any of these men would've fared with the Ring but all I know is Aragorn didn't budge once!


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