# Beleriand



## Squajbob (Jan 7, 2004)

Sorry if this has been asked before, but where exactly is Beleriand located, comparing to Middle Earth in the 3rd Age. In the index of the Silmarillion, it says that the grassy plains north of Angband, Ard-Galen (spelling?) was also Rohan. So I was just wondering if this area evolved into the 3rd age middle earth.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but is Middle Earth made up of all the area north, south, and east of the lands in the LotR, or just the regions in LotR?


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## Starflower (Jan 7, 2004)

ok first of all, Beleriand did no longer exist in the Third Age, it was destroyed in the War of the Valar against Morgoth in the end of the First Age. Only Ossiriand survived, to be later named Lindon, where for example the Havens are. And it was situated in theextreme north-west of Middle-earth. 
All the lands that are talked about in LoTR make Middle-earth, and apart from Middle-earth there is Valinor, the land of the Valar. And I'm pretty sure that the there was no Rohan in Beleriand, Ard-galen is the name of the plains between Angband and the fence of Beleriand in the south....


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## Squajbob (Jan 7, 2004)

All right. I knew there was no Beleriand in the 3rd age, as well as no Rohan, but if you see the index in The Sil, you'll see a reference to Rohan in the entry to Ard-galen. I just wanted to know what that meant.

Also, when you were talking about Middle Earth, do you mean that most of the lands east of Mordor in the 3rd age are gone? Because in the 1st age, there was that great inland sea far to the east. So does Middle Earth, as refered to in LotR, include that area?


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## Maeglin (Jan 7, 2004)

The lands to the East of Mordor are not gone, but rather, most of the lands to the West of Mordor are gone, they were all flooded over by the Valar after the war against Morgoth. To give you a better of idea of what/where Beleriand is, take out a map of Middle-Earth during the 3rd age.....do you see the Ered Luin (Blue Mountains), way over on the westernmost part of Middle-Earth, near the Grey Havens? Okay now take out a map of Beleriand, and notice that the Ered Luin are way way over on the Easternmost part of the map; they and everything west of them was Beleriand, or Middle-Earth, in the first age.  

As for the plains of Rohan being referred to, I don't know what to say, I've never heard that before, but Rohan didn't exist at the time. Although it's origins were far to the North in 3rd age ME....that's the only similarity I can think of between the plains of Ard-galen and the people of Rohan.


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## Beleg (Jan 8, 2004)

Cirion the steward of Gondor handed over the Planes of Calenardhon to Eorl the Young after the battle of the Field of Celebrant. 
The region afterwards was called Rohan.


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## Starflower (Jan 8, 2004)

but if you see the index in The Sil, you'll see a reference to Rohan in the entry to Ard-galen.

that might just mean that in the context of Ard-galen there is a cross-reference to Rohan, maybe discussing the similarities of the two


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## Lantarion (Jan 8, 2004)

The reference seen in the Silmarillion is purely linguistic: Ard-galen, as well as Calen-ardhon, mean "Green plain" (Ard = ardhon; galen = calen). This seems to be a coincidence, or maybe another of Tolkien's many allusions to the Sil present in the LotR.
Glorfindel gave good instructions to visualize Beleriand in context of Middle-earth in the Third Age, I suggest you try that if you're still not grasping it. 
The grassy plains north of Angband were originally called Ard-galen, but after the Dagor Bragollach and Glaurung's defilement it was renamed the Anfauglith, "Gasping Dust".


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## Squajbob (Jan 8, 2004)

Yea, Glorfindel's description was great, and I think I see where Rohan fits in there. Thanks


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## Ravenna (Jan 13, 2004)

Another way to help position Beleriand against ME of the third age is to use the Hill of Himring which appears on the maps in LoTR as an island called Himling just off the coast to the east on the Ered Luin. 
At least thats the way I did it


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## Flame of Udûn (Jan 13, 2004)

This may help.


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## Maeglin (Jan 14, 2004)

Ravenna said:


> Another way to help position Beleriand against ME of the third age is to use the Hill of Himring which appears on the maps in LoTR as an island called Himling just off the coast to the east on the Ered Luin.
> At least thats the way I did it



You mean just off the coast to the West?


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## Ravenna (Jan 14, 2004)

Glorfindel1187 said:


> You mean just off the coast to the West?



Yes. How clever of you to spot my deliberate  mistake!  
Would you believe I had the map the wrong way up?


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## Lantarion (Jan 15, 2004)

Flame of Udûn, I don't agree with that map; in that scale Beleriand would have been smaller than Eriador, when it was in fact far, far larger.


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## Flame of Udûn (Jan 15, 2004)

Sorry, I was just trying to help. I didn't make the map.


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## Arvedui (Jan 15, 2004)

A good map for comparison can be found here. 
WARNING: It's huge!!!
Lantarion knows who made it.


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## Lantarion (Jan 15, 2004)

Ah!! The venerable Mrs. Wynn-Fonstad! 
Good job pointing that out Arvy.


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## Adanedhel (Dec 21, 2011)

Does anybody knows if there was a capital city or at least a city in Hithlum?


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