# Must read classics (merged threads)



## reem (Jul 11, 2003)

*A Hopeless Case*

it has come to my attention...or rather, i have observed, that almost no one on this forum reads classics!!! is there NO one to give the lie to my above statement?!!?
reem


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## Celebthôl (Jul 11, 2003)

Define classics...


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## HLGStrider (Jul 12, 2003)

I read War and Peace, David Copperfield, Silas Marriner, Swiss Family Robinson, various Jules Verne, various Dumas, the Jungle Book, a lot of Macdonald, some Alcott.

I guess you do need to define classics. Are we talking about literature or poetry?

I started to read the Illiad, but I forget why I stopped.


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## reem (Jul 12, 2003)

classics: things generally written by Charles Dickens, Jane Austen, Jules Verne, Thomas Hardy, Daniel Defoe and the like. it needs not be constricted to just prose, but poetry also, like that written by Robert Burnes and Shakespear...etc.
you know, classics, those books which no one seems to want to read unless they were forced to by their teachers
those classics!
reem


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## Celebthôl (Jul 12, 2003)

Oh...well im sorry to make ur above statement...accurate


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## HLGStrider (Jul 13, 2003)

Well, I listed what I've read in that genre, though I will add three or four Shakespeare plays, "The Prince," and "In Praise of Follies" to the list.


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## reem (Jul 15, 2003)

yes yes, but WHY don't people like reading them??
i don't beleive that there is such a thing as an 'unreadable' book. everything can be read, and with a certain amount of pleasure too, given te right time. that's my theory on books. you can never rush a book because each book has it's own time. but in the end, a book can always be read. 
for example, i never thought that i would ever come anywhere near a classic, because my abhorance for them was so intense that they utterly depress me!! i never could concentrate when reading them and they pretty much bored me to death when i did!! but now, well let's just say that ALL i read is clasics!! they're AMAZING!! especially dickens!! imagine ME saying that i adore DICKENSS !! i mean, that must be as impossible as a pig sprouting wings and flying!! but it happened! so, my question is, why don't people give it a try? if u didn't like it now, try it later, because ur sure to like, no matter ur prefference in book genres. see what i mean? it's already bad enough that people these days barely read, let alone reading classics! (that excludes u and I, HLG). people are really issing out of alot. it really does seem like a hopeless case sigh
reem


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## Celebthôl (Jul 15, 2003)

Because they are to real, there is no action, they have olden day themes. That isn't really what people want in todays society...


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## reem (Jul 15, 2003)

no no no, my friend! since when do themes ever change? there is only one theme for all books and stories, and they all deal with some form or other of 'human nature'. the struggle is always the same:
1-man versus self
2-man versus man
3-man versus nature
so tell me where the difference is?!
ok, if u want to go into the details of story telling, then yes i supose there is less blowing-up of braina and less..ehm, u know what i mean, but that doesn't make it any less as interestig or delightful. there is as much feeling and emotion in classics as there can ever be in books today. ...come to think of it, there's even more of humanity in them than there is now!! books these days don't concern themelfs with good plots as much as ...er...'special effect', you can say. 
.......i think what makes people not like classics is not the choice of the material in question, rahter the language. people have becoe illiterate to all quality works of arts! (me not excluded...but i can honestly say that i have greatly improved and can hold myself aloof from the many others who ave not had the pleasure or good fortune of improving in this respect).
i don't think that any satisfactory excuse can be made concerning this point. people have just lost touc with what is ..'better'. i say 'better' in the intellectual sense...of course, coming from soeone with suc bad spelling and very little intillectualy must be somewhat amusing, but still, i stick to what i have
reem


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## HLGStrider (Jul 16, 2003)

I am not crazy about Dickens, though my sister likes him. 

I read one Dickens, David Copperfield, and was just so annoyed with "Davey" that I was about to start pounding my fist into the book. . .I listened to the Tale of Two Cities when my mom read it to us as part of our study on that time period (I'm homeschooled, so it was part of school), and I found that to be a lot better, and of course my dad read us the Christmas Carol at Christmas.

I don't generally like books in First Person.

A lot of classics have good action. Ivanhoe, for instance. I named my cat Ivanhoe. . .

I don't believe themes change, but I don't think you put them right. 

I think there is a good deal that is man trying to understand God, be God, or fight God.

I rarely read new books. I don't know how to decide if one is good. A lot of new books seem to have silly themes and less story and very stereotypical characters.

I find older books refreshing.

I can point you to other classic lovers.

Try Eriol
Grond
I think Gil-Gilad
Walter. . .

I know there are more, but you'll have to fish for them yourself.


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## reem (Jul 16, 2003)

hmm...oh well, maybe i should try starting a 'classics guild' or something...can anyone do that or what? ...even if it worked and i did start it, i doubt that many people will join. what do u think??
reem


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## HLGStrider (Jul 17, 2003)

Some people would probably join. You'd have to define classics carefully or not at all, depending on your style.


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## Feanorian (Jul 17, 2003)

Well if we are saying Dickens is classic what about Machiaveli? Hobbes? Thomas Paine? Henry Robert Thoreau? Aristotle? Homer? Etc?

I personally would rather read any of those classic authors then Austen, Dickens, Hemingwey(sp), etc.


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## HLGStrider (Jul 17, 2003)

Hey, I listed Macheivelli. . .actually, I listed the Prince because I couldn't quite remember how to spell Machievilelli. . .uh. . .macha. . .Maicha. . .Nicolo! His first name was Nicolo! I think. . .I may be wrong.


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## Feanorian (Jul 17, 2003)

Yah Nicollo Machiaveli. He gets the most credit fore the Prince but deserves just as much for Dicourses and The Art of War.


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## HLGStrider (Jul 18, 2003)

Fraid I haven't read those. . .I need to reread the Sil. That's next on my list. . .I just finished a long book and am reading a shorter one. . .then I go to the long again.


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## reem (Jul 18, 2003)

i suppose it could be an 'any' classic guild...you know, whatever falls under that category...how do i go about it, if i was to go about it??
reem


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## HLGStrider (Jul 18, 2003)

If I were you I'd start a guild thread in Other Guilds and Societies and do my best to recruit members. If you get enough members, and a guild space becomes free, then you will probably get your own guild space.

You can't force these things you know.


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## FoolOfATook (Jul 20, 2003)

You're absolutely right. I've never read anything by Robert Burnes.

Now Robert Burns, on the other hand.... 

(See what happens when you accuse the sarcastic, arrogant lit major that he isn't well-read )


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## reem (Jul 20, 2003)

hmm...well, thanks for the info, HLG
when i get some time i'll try and do that...if it proves to be worth it!!
oh well. thanks again
reem


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## reem (Jul 20, 2003)

> _Originally posted by FoolOfATook _
> *You're absolutely right. I've never read anything by Robert Burnes.
> 
> Now Robert Burns, on the other hand....
> ...



hehehe!! oops!! ok! i stand corrected! hehe!! must double check everything i write before writting it!! 
reem


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## HLGStrider (Jul 22, 2005)

*Re: A Hopeless Case*

I've read quite a few classics since this subject came up. . .so I want to brag about them.
I read the Divine Comedy. I read Paradise Lost. I read several things by Dosteovsky. I read the Orestia. King Solomen's Mines, the House of Seven Gables, Metamorphisis, Solzneitzen (too modern to count?), The Agony and the Ecstasy. . .

My next book in line is the Brother's Karamozov (I like Dosteovsky-ovksy-eye).


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## reem (Jul 24, 2005)

*Re: A Hopeless Case*

Heh, I grew out of my Classics-reading phase last year Now stuck on historical fiction 
Good to see that you've been busy with them though, Elgie Any recommendations?


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## HLGStrider (Jul 24, 2005)

*Re: A Hopeless Case*

I imagine a lot of historical fiction could be considered classic. It seems to be more a matter of age than genre. 

Anyways, just about everything I listed was excellent. Well, except Orestia. I read that because I was in a performance of it, and Greek tragedy isn't my "thing."

_The Agony and the Ecstasy_ is historical fiction and beautifully written. It is by Irving Stone, about Michealangelo. If you are at all interested in the Rennaisance period of Italy, I'd pick it up.


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## e.Blackstar (Jul 25, 2005)

*Re: A Hopeless Case*

I've read The Iliad, The Odyssey, The Chosen (by Chaim Potok), Romeo and Juliet, and a couple others that don't come to mind right now...pretty pathetic.


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## Violanthe (Jan 24, 2006)

What are the classic novels and stories that everyone ought to read? Those essentials for any good literature fan? What are the literary classics you would name as prerequisites for enjoying literature today? What are the essential classics of general literature, and what are the genre-specific essentials?


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## Violanthe (Jan 31, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

Okay, I'll try starting this one off. 

In terms of must read classics, I think that Hamlet comes most easily to mind. But otherwise, I missed a lot of the "classic canon" in school because they tried to expose us to less well-known authors.

And, of course, LOTR is THE classic of the fantasy genre


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## Annaheru (Jan 31, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

hmm, let me think:

Plutarch's _Lives_ should be standard reading (incredible study of human frailty in positions of power)

Sun Tzu's _Art of War _(great foundation for both military and economic tactics)

Dostoyevsky's _Crime and Punishment_

Homer

romance? _Pride and Prejudice_

law we'll go with Blackstone, Locke and Hume

for the history buff: Tacitus (everything), Patrick O'Brien (Naval history- my favourite is _The Unknown Shore_)

for the western. . . Louis L'Amour- All, if you like westerns you'll understand why he's king.

scifi, let's go with Frank Herbert's _Dune_

fantasy- Silmarillion (yes, I like sil over LoTR- can you tell I love history?)


There you have my short list- there are so many, many others (I avoided plays and poetry, if you noticed)


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## Aiwendil2 (Feb 2, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

I would say these are essential:
The Iliad
The Odyssey
The Aeneid

Every English speaker should probably read at least a few Shakespeare plays, though I don't know that any particular ones are essential.

I'd also say that the following are pretty important:
Portions of the Bible
Beowulf
The Divine Comedy
The Canterbury Tales
Faust pt. 1 (Goethe)
Crime and Punishment
Some Dickens (maybe A Tale of Two Cities)
The Great Gatsby
The Silmarillion (or LotR)
The Foundation series

Though of course the last there two don't generally show up on critics' lists . . .

For philosophical writings I'd say:
The Republic (Plato)
A little Aristotle (maybe the Nicomachean Ethics and Politics)
Augustine's Confessions
Summa Theologiae (Aquinas)
Leviathan (Hobbes)
Meditations on First Philosophy (Descartes)
A little Locke and Rousseau
A little Kant (maybe Grounding for the Metaphysics of Morals)
Marx's early writings
The Analysis of Sensations (Ernst Mach)


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## Gandalf White (Feb 2, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*



Aiwendil2 said:


> For philosophical writings I'd say:
> The Republic (Plato)
> A little Aristotle (maybe the Nicomachean Ethics and Politics)
> Augustine's Confessions
> ...



Nietzsche *must* be added in there somewhere.


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## Violanthe (Feb 7, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

I think I was the only one in my junior English class who actually enjoyed Beowulf


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## HLGStrider (Feb 7, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

Hm. . .Classics.
I read _War and Peace _but didn't like it. Dosteovsky, however, anything by him is great.
Some Dumas.
The Divine Comedy and Paradise Lost for poetry. Leshee. . .what else . . . hmm. . . 

There is a lot more, but I'm too tired to list them.


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## Aiwendil2 (Feb 15, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*



> Nietzsche must be added in there somewhere.



Yes, I suppose you're right. I was trying to keep the list short, but I suppose "Beyond Good and Evil" at least ought to be added. I also omitted Hegel, who can be quite painful to read but who was very important not only in his own right but also as an influence on both Marx and Nietzche. Sartre might also be added to the list. Also, I did not include several twentieth century philosophers who are in my opinion rather important but whose works are not generally considered part of the "canon" - Wittgenstein, Carnap, Schlick, etc. I did make a concession to personal taste by putting Mach on the list.

I should note also that all my suggestions come from a very western viewpoint. I don't mean to assert the superiority of the western tradition over others; but, as I am a westerner, it is the one I am most familiar with.


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## Elbereth (Mar 16, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

I'm going to give a nod to some great American classic authors for a change.

Ernest Hemingway - "The Grape of Wrath" and "East of Eden"

F. Scott Fitzgerald - "The Great Gatsby" & "This Side of Paradise"

Margaret Mitchell - "Gone with the Wind"


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## Rhiannon (Mar 17, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

There are several 'children's' books that I think are important reading--

_To Kill a Mockingbird_ by Harper Lee
_Bridge to Terabithia_ by Katherine Paterson
_Beauty: A Retelling of Beauty and the Beast_ by Robin McKinley (for girls--not to be sexist, but I think this story is important for young girls to hear, and not so much for young guys--according to my brother, _Huck Finn_ is more important reading for guys than girls)

I can name more, but those are the three primary ones. Reading was (is) crucial for me when I hit 'the change'  so my favorite book list is peppered with coming of age stories. 

Everyone should reading _The Hiding Place_ by Corrie ten Boom. 

Everyone should read some Ray Bradbury--personally I like _Dandilion Wine_ most of all. 

Everyone should read some Edgar Allan Poe. 

Everyone should read some poetry other than Wordsworth and Dickinson, which I've been forced to read ad nauseum. I'm an advocate of more John Donne and less Wordsworth. More TS Eliot and less Dickinson (especially the _same Wordsworth and Dickinson poems over and over_). 

Everyone should read Musashi's _The Book of Five Rings_. Because if they don't, the Japanese will eventually take over the world. 

Everyone should be familiar with the Volsung Saga. 

And everyone should read some Dorothy Parker. Because she makes me laugh. 

And, because I wear a sign that says 'Yes, I _do_ read comic books', I think more people (maybe not _everyone[/i'], but more people) should read Neil Gaiman's Sandman series and Alan Moore's The Watchmen._


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## Kementari (Mar 17, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

"Crime and Punishment" - Dostoevsky

"Jane Eyre" "Wuthering Heights" "The Tennant of Wildfell Hall" - Bronte Sisters

"Great Expectations" - Dickens

"Canterbury Tales" - Chaucer (life lessons)

"The Bhagavad Gita" 

"Siddhartha" - Hermann Hesse


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## Mithrandir (Mar 17, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

Also "Crime and Punishement" ~Dostoevsky

"The Plague"~ Albert Camus

"The Sound and the Fury" ~William Faulkner 

"Hamlet"~ Shakespear, it is a play I know, but I believe it break the boundaries.

"Frankenstein" ~Mary Shelly

All of these books have had a huge impact on how I think, write, and live my life both in my high school years and today. They are classic literature that I 
consider a must read by anyone who wants to learn to live a life intellectually, spiritually, and with keen insite. Enjoy ^_^
~Mithers


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## Barliman Butterbur (Mar 18, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*



Violanthe said:


> What are the classic novels and stories that everyone ought to read? Those essentials for any good literature fan? What are the literary classics you would name as prerequisites for enjoying literature today? What are the essential classics of general literature, and what are the genre-specific essentials?



I recommend the works of Ray Bradbury and Theodore Sturgeon. Those two authors certainly took up a lot of my reading time when in high school (some 50+ years ago). Later on, Arthur C. Clark. Clark was more valuable for his scarily accurate predictive ideas about the technology of the future (both human and alien), the other two for their fantasy imagination and style.

Kementari reminds me that Dickens and Twain are great English language masters of storytelling, and I would especially recommend any and all of their works, especially Twain's _Letters from the Earth._ 

Right up there with Twain and Dickens as masters of expressive, precise, subtle, vivid and highly individualistic written English, I would include the psychologist/philosopher William James. I especially recommend his _Will to Believe, The Varieties of Religious Experience,_ and _The Principles of Psychology,_ the latter having been written as a high school text — which says volumes for the difference in high school education (and high school students!) then and now. I think that (outside of Shakespeare, who is a universe unto himself) that these are the three greatest _modern_ writers in the English language.

As for the Baghavad Gita, I found that quite a bit later in my life, and I recommend it for its Eastern/Hindu takes on spirituality and ethics, but there are so many different writers' versions of it, that there isn't anything definitive I could recommend as _the_ English language version. I doubt that anyone wants to tackle it in the original Sanskrit! 

(Once out of high school I went into the Air Force, and my mind was on other things. When I got out of the service, I began college and a first marriage and family. When in college I had to spend all my time studying and working. I had so many education classes I never had any time or opportunity for the humanities classes I longed to take. So I envy you all the titles that you've mentioned you've read. Nowadays I doubt I'd have the patience to read them, although you have me tempted to try!)

Barley


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## Talierin (Mar 18, 2006)

*Re: Must read classics*

I just picked up a whole ton of classic Arthur C Clarke novels (along with quite a few other classic sci fi authors) for free (god I love working at the library), looking forward to getting around to reading them, as I've never read much of his stuff.


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## Violanthe (Mar 21, 2006)

> Everyone should be familiar with the Volsung Saga.


 
And if they enjoy Volsungs, I would recommend they check out Njal's Saga next.


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