# Silmarillion Movie



## elladan (Aug 3, 2011)

I understand that the Silmarillion as a whole occurs over too long of a time period and has too many main characters for it ever to be a movie. But there is one part of it that I believe could be a adapted into a very good movie. That is the story of Beren and Luthien. Of all the stories in the Silmarillion, this would require the least back story and it follows just two characters over a relatively short period of time. And the story itself is amazing, probably my favorite in the book. Plus, it has some semblance of a happy ending, unlike just about all the other tales in the Sil. The story of Turin would make a good movie too, but it would be far too depressing! I think a Beren and Luthien movie could work, and I know I would love to see it on screen.

Any thoughts?


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## baragund (Aug 5, 2011)

Agreed. Either Turin or Beren / Luthien, and Turin is just too depressing for anyone to want to make a movie out of his tragic life.


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## Bard the Bowman (Aug 13, 2011)

What I would love to see is a Silmarillion show. They could make an episode based on each event. There is easily enough events. If you know of any producer that wants a good writer for the Silmarillion show, I will gladly lend my services.


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## Erestor Arcamen (Aug 14, 2011)

Kind of the way that they're doing A Game of Thrones? George R. R. Martin's books are so detailed, I didn't think they'd be able to pull it off but season 1 rocked.


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## Starbrow (Aug 16, 2011)

I think it would be great to see the tale of Beren and Luthien be made into a movie. You could do some awesome special effects with Saruman's battles. I don't know about the rest of the Silmarillion, though. Maybe some chapters like Turin and the Fall of Gondolin, but it would be hard to link them together with so many different characters.


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## Thorin (Aug 16, 2011)

I would love to see a movie called 'Gondolin'. The fall of Gondolin as embellished in Book of Lost Tales II would be so epic on screen it would give you a heart attack! The version in Sil is completely toned down from Tolkien's earlier version in BoLT II. Read it sometime if you get the chance. It is a white knuckle page turner of dragons and hundreds of balrogs clashing with Elves! Awesome!


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## elladan (Aug 21, 2011)

I agree that a movie about the fall of Gondolin would be very interesting. 

But the big question. Would the rights ever be given to any film maker to adapt anything in the Silmarillion? I know that Christopher Tolkien is pretty much against the idea of allowing films to be made of any of the works posthumously published works. I'm not exactly sure why that is, but likely enough it will preclude anyone from making any such movies, at least for quite a long time.

Which is quite the bummer if you ask me. Who knows though, something could be made anyway, maybe by the same guys who made the 35 minute youtube movie, "The Hunt for Gollum", which I watched awhile back. I thought it was rather well done, especially considering the low budget. Obviously the special effects were not on the same level, but as far as the acting went, I think it rivaled Peter Jacksons movies. And actually the lack of special effects may have helped it along somewhat. If you can't make a film super visually appealing, then you actually need to focus on the characters, themes, etc, which can be a good thing. I did enjoy Peter Jackson's movies, but I think far too much of the focus was on the action and the special effects (which _were _very good), and not enough on portraying the themes, Tolkien's subtle humor, and the very unique feel feel of Middle Earth. Jackson did an excellent job creating a very exciting movie, but most of magic that Tolkien so masterfully wove into the story was lost, and that was upsetting. 

I got a little off topic there, and I do apologize for that. But I guess my point is, I hope that if a movie based on the Silmarillion is made, more of the beauty and poetry of Tolkien's writing is left intact than in Jacksons Lord of the Rings.


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## Black Captain (Dec 10, 2011)

Personally, I think they should make two movies: The first be titled _Akallabêth,_from the Silmarilion, and then I think they should make a movie titled _Narn I Hin Hurin,_ from the book of lost tales. I know Turin's story is pretty depressing, but it would be so freaking epic. If they did make a NIHH, I think it should be rated "R," so as to be able to include all the blood and gore, as well as the finding of the mind-erased Nienor.


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 10, 2011)

I agree with you Black Captain. Turin's story I think would be better, because I think the main villain is better. Glaurung would be a better villain the the insane Carcharoth. R rated for sure. One thing I will disagree with you is on the name. Definitely Children of Hurin.


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## Black Captain (Dec 10, 2011)

The Children of Hurin is fine an' all, but I think that the elvish rendering puts more meaning into it. If you've ever said aloud, _*NARN I HIN HURIN*_! You'll know how awsome it is. However, if you yell, "the children of Hurin!, that just doesn't get it for me. But anyway, my favorite part would actually be when he chases that punk elf off some cliff after beatin' the s**t out of him. That was so cool.


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 11, 2011)

I think it would be more intriguing to non-Tolkien audiences as "The Children of Hurin". But my favorite part to see would be when he kills Glaurung and mocks him.


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## Elthir (Dec 11, 2011)

To raise a now somewhat old and certainly pedantic note (but since pronunciation has been raised): the actual spelling should be Narn i·Chîn Húrin, with ch pronounced with the sound as in German _ach_. Christopher Tolkien himself changed this, because he wanted to avoid English 'chin', but he notes the proper mutation and sound in any case.

As for a possible film, from the Tolkien Estate website (upon the publication of the book):



> *Are there any plans to produce a feature film from The Children of Húrin?
> 
> *There are no plans of this nature in the foreseeable future.




Of course there's nothing wrong with chatting about the possibility in any case


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## baragund (Dec 13, 2011)

The Akallabeth could make a pretty interesting movie. A lot of crazy stuff going on once Sauron got his hooks into the government. And the sailing of Ar-Pharazon's fleet to invade the Undying Lands would be spectacular!


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## Starbrow (Dec 13, 2011)

Peter Jackson could have a field day with all the epic battles in the Akallabeth - the defeat of Sauron and then the invasion of the Undying Lands. There's even some female characters in the story, so maybe he wouldn't have to invent them.


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 14, 2011)

Yeah, but Jackson would still find some way to bungle it all up. Maybe the elves of Lothlorien would show up there too.


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## Prince of Cats (Dec 14, 2011)

Did you know that there were actually hobbits there, too? :*D :*D


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## Erestor Arcamen (Dec 14, 2011)

Prince of Cats said:


> Did you know that there were actually hobbits there, too? :*D :*D


 
Where? sorry I missed it...:*confused:


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## Black Captain (Dec 15, 2011)

I think Bard has a point. Jackson would no doubt create a giant kraken attacking Numenor or summat. They should hire us to direct and write it! Then it would be a lot better, and a lot more faithful to the story.


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## Prince of Cats (Dec 15, 2011)

Erestor Arcamen said:


> Where? sorry I missed it...:*confused:


 
It was cringe humor, thinking about Jackson putting hobbits in a movie of a tale from The Silmarillion


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## Erestor Arcamen (Dec 15, 2011)

Oh ok lol sorry I understand. He may add his own scene specifically showing the Hobbits from their origins somewhere in there if he does it though, you never know...


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 17, 2011)

What are people's thoughts on a tv show? Or a mini-series? For example, in the Silmarillion mini-series Melkor's darkening of Valinor could be one movie.


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## Adanedhel (Dec 18, 2011)

i agree with the idea of making a mini-series film of the silmarillion, where every chapter would be an episode. i think also that narn i hin hurin could become a nice movie with a few good battles. Or beren and luthien.


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 18, 2011)

The Children of Hurin is the story I want most to be made into a movies. I think though, that it would be at least two movies (at least!).


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## Adanedhel (Dec 18, 2011)

and where would the first part end?


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 18, 2011)

Hmmm, good question. You could either end with Turin just joining the outlaws, but my personal choice would probably be after Gwindor restores Turin after he kills Beleg. It would be a fresh start.


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## Black Captain (Dec 19, 2011)

A many series would be ideal, as long as it had good special effects and good actors. It would need to be very high budget.


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## Adanedhel (Dec 19, 2011)

I 'd love to watch the Nirnaeth Arnoeniad in the silver screen. Elves, Balrogs, Men, Dragons, Dwarves, Orcs. What an epic battle!


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 19, 2011)

The Children of Hurin movie should start out with a prologue like Lord of the Rings did, "it began with the making of the three Silmarils. blah blah blah explaining briefly about the War of the Jewels and how the Noldor came to Beleriand and briefly touching on what happened up to the Nirnaeth Arnoediad. Then just as LOTR showed the Last Alliance this would show the Battle of Unnumbered Tears. It would focus mainly on Hurin though. I'm working on an outline for the movie(s), or whatever it turns out to be. I'll post it when I'm finished


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## Black Captain (Dec 19, 2011)

Bard the Bowman said:


> The Children of Hurin movie should start out with a prologue like Lord of the Rings did, "it began with the making of the three Silmarils. blah blah blah explaining briefly about the War of the Jewels and how the Noldor came to Beleriand and briefly touching on what happened up to the Nirnaeth Arnoediad. Then just as LOTR showed the Last Alliance this would show the Battle of Unnumbered Tears. It would focus mainly on Hurin though. I'm working on an outline for the movie(s), or whatever it turns out to be. I'll post it when I'm finished


 

Cool. I'll edit.


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## Adanedhel (Dec 20, 2011)

i agree with the prologue but i would prefere to see an extended edition of the Nirnaeth (like the battle in the pelennor fields). Imagine it!
About the number of the parts of the movie "the Children of Hurin", i think it would be nice of making a trilogy (again!). The first part would end with the arrival of Turin at the lawlesses and the second part with the fall of Nargothrond. What do you think?


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## Bard the Bowman (Dec 20, 2011)

Certainly the Nirnaeth Arnoediad would be extended. I was thinking the prologue would not even include the battle, it would simply lead up to the battle, and the actual movie start at the time of the battle, or before. Like maybe when Hurin is about to leave. I'll explain it all in my outline. As far as 3 movies go, perhaps. However I think they should end at Turin being expelled from Doriath, Gwindor healing him, and the last movie wraps it up. The biggest problem will be the names. The prologue will have to explain much, but can it explain enough?


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## Sir Gawain d'Orchany (May 8, 2018)

elladan said:


> I understand that the Silmarillion as a whole occurs over too long of a time period and has too many main characters for it ever to be a movie. But there is one part of it that I believe could be a adapted into a very good movie. That is the story of Beren and Luthien. Of all the stories in the Silmarillion, this would require the least back story and it follows just two characters over a relatively short period of time. And the story itself is amazing, probably my favorite in the book. Plus, it has some semblance of a happy ending, unlike just about all the other tales in the Sil. The story of Turin would make a good movie too, but it would be far too depressing! I think a Beren and Luthien movie could work, and I know I would love to see it on screen.
> 
> Any thoughts?


Either that or The Fall of Gondolin would make great movies. The Fall of Gondolin would be an epic trilogy


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## Halasían (May 11, 2018)

Sadly, with the latest words I hear about the Amazon TV series, it will seem that _NOTHING_ Middle Earth related can be brought to movie or TV screens without PJ having his hand in it.


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## CirdanLinweilin (May 11, 2018)

Halasían said:


> it will seem that _NOTHING_ Middle Earth related can be brought to movie or TV screens without PJ having his hand in it


Tell me you are _JOKING.

_
CL


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## Halasían (May 11, 2018)

I wish I was. Apparently it is up tp PJ to decide if he will work on the TV series or some DC projects. I'll see if I can find the link.

_Edit: Say it isn't so Joe...._


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (May 11, 2018)

Aargh.


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## CirdanLinweilin (May 11, 2018)

Halasían said:


> I wish I was. Apparently it is up tp PJ to decide if he will work on the TV series or some DC projects. I'll see if I can find the link.


Eru help us all....

(And God.)


CL


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (May 16, 2018)

I keep telling myself to stay away from movie/TV threads, but something brought me back to this one (I'm looking at YOU, CL! )

The need for a prologue was mentioned a couple of times above. That may be necessary in a Silmarillion movie, but I thought the one in FOTR was a mistake. I know that "no one ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of his audience", and all, but I found it to be another example of the "anticipation" that Tolkien warned about.

One of the things that captivated me, on first reading LOTR, was the sense of mystery, or actually a series of unfolding mysteries, that we follow Frodo through, as Bilbo's ring, which he merely thinks "may be useful", turns out to be the Ring.

He (and we) learn something of its history and significance from Gandalf, but then have to experience an entire book of adventures before leaning more of its long story. And those experiences are important for understanding. For instance, Gandalf mentions the Nine briefly, but does not, of course, know that they have arisen. Therefore, Frodo doesn't connect them with the Black Riders he encounters, until receiving more information from Strider, and then at the Council. Until then, they remain a mystery (or to be less anachronistic, perhaps I should say "riddle", as that's the term Tolkien uses consistently). By then he has had direct experience with them, making the information he receives much more meaningful.

By putting so much of this in the prologue, the movie, it seems to me, "flattens out" the mystery. The solution, if PJ wanted (understandably) to avoid long stretches of expostional dialog, would have been to place the "flashback" sequences in their proper places, accompanying the stories of Gandalf at Bag End, and Elrond at the Council, for instance.


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## CirdanLinweilin (May 16, 2018)

Squint-eyed Southerner said:


> I keep telling myself to stay away from movie/TV threads, but something brought me back to this one (I'm looking at YOU, CL! )


Sorry Bro, totally was not my intention.


Good explanation though. 


CL


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (May 16, 2018)

Oh, I'm just joshing. 

I can't blame someone else, if I can't control myself!


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## CirdanLinweilin (May 16, 2018)

Squint-eyed Southerner said:


> Oh, I'm just joshing.
> 
> I can't blame someone else, if I can't control myself!


Alright, cool bro.



CL


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (May 17, 2018)

Apologies, CL, you've made me change (or is it lose?) my mind: you got me curious enough to browse some of the old movie threads. I only say LOL when it _really_ happens, which is rarely, but one post gave me two such moments:*

1. "Sauron the Evil Lighthouse".

2. (On the Dead at MT):
"What? Scrubbing Bubbles kill Mumakil?".

So thanks for that. Or something. 


*So much so that I actually had a hard time typing this!


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## CirdanLinweilin (May 17, 2018)

Squint-eyed Southerner said:


> Apologies, CL, you've made me change (or is it lose?) my mind: you got me curious enough to browse some of the old movie threads. I only say LOL when it _really_ happens, which is rarely, but one post gave me two such moments:*
> 
> 1. "Sauron the Evil Lighthouse".
> 
> ...



Welcome. The pleasure is all mine.


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (May 17, 2018)

It appears there have been some real wits here, over the years.

Let's hope some of them return when the TV series begins!


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## CirdanLinweilin (May 17, 2018)

Squint-eyed Southerner said:


> It appears there have been some real wits here, over the years.
> 
> Let's hope some of them return when the TV series begins!



We can only hope...

*Stares dreamily off into the West...*

P.S. When the show does get underway, will there be a new section added to the Fora where it has the LOTR and Hobbit trilogies? Or will it just be discussed in Other Related Topics. I've been curious about that.

CL


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (May 17, 2018)

Well, it did happen with the Hobbit movie forum. And though I don't know, it looks as if a number of threads got moved there when that was created.

I imagine something similar will happen with the series, but maybe one of the long-suffering staff members can tell us.


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## Tyler Eaton (Jun 7, 2018)

elladan said:


> I understand that the Silmarillion as a whole occurs over too long of a time period and has too many main characters for it ever to be a movie. But there is one part of it that I believe could be a adapted into a very good movie. That is the story of Beren and Luthien. Of all the stories in the Silmarillion, this would require the least back story and it follows just two characters over a relatively short period of time. And the story itself is amazing, probably my favorite in the book. Plus, it has some semblance of a happy ending, unlike just about all the other tales in the Sil. The story of Turin would make a good movie too, but it would be far too depressing! I think a Beren and Luthien movie could work, and I know I would love to see it on screen.
> 
> Any thoughts?



As somebody who works in television, I feel like a story of this size would have to be on TV, most likely on HBO, ala 'Game of Thrones'. There's just too much to squeeze into a movie, even a trilogy unless you take one tiny piece of it like Paul Thomas Anderson did with adaption 'Oil!' into 'There Will Be Blood'.


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## Halasían (Jun 7, 2018)

Tyler Eaton said:


> As somebody who works in television, I feel like a story of this size would have to be on TV, most likely on HBO, ala 'Game of Thrones'. There's just too much to squeeze into a movie, even a trilogy unless you take one tiny piece of it like Paul Thomas Anderson did with adaption 'Oil!' into 'There Will Be Blood'.



Yes, it would have to be done in seasonal chapters, where part of the tale is explored through the episodes of that season.

Anyway, maybe in my lifetime there will be a Silmarillion TV mini-series.


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (Jun 10, 2018)

Although Beren and Luthien, or the Tale of Turin Turambar, could make epic self-contained movies.

The latter would be something of a downer, admittedly! I'm not sure how audiences would react to that one.


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## Ithilethiel (Jun 11, 2018)

Halasían said:


> Sadly, with the latest words I hear about the Amazon TV series, it will seem that _NOTHING_ Middle Earth related can be brought to movie or TV screens without PJ having his hand in it.



_*Rhaich!*_



Squint-eyed Southerner said:


> Apologies, CL, you've made me change (or is it lose?) my mind: you got me curious enough to browse some of the old movie threads. I only say LOL when it _really_ happens, which is rarely, but one post gave me two such moments:*
> 
> 1. "Sauron the Evil Lighthouse".
> 
> ...



Scrubbing Bubbles! The Evil Lighthouse! I love it!


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## CirdanLinweilin (Jun 11, 2018)

Ithilethiel said:


> Rhaich!


_Gesundheit._
_
_
CL


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## octoburn (Jun 11, 2018)

Tyler Eaton said:


> As somebody who works in television, I feel like a story of this size would have to be on TV, most likely on HBO, ala 'Game of Thrones'. There's just too much to squeeze into a movie, even a trilogy unless you take one tiny piece of it like Paul Thomas Anderson did with adaption 'Oil!' into 'There Will Be Blood'.


I said for a while that I would approach it the way the Dark Tower books are being adapted (but closer adaptations ) into films AND tv. But now I think the interconnectedness of the story would make the tv seasons disjointed from the films (plus, some of the films would actually overlap and it could be very complicated story-wise) and think that if done on film, it should be all television series. But it would take a budget twice that of Game of Thrones to deliver the Silmarillion properly to the screen.

Because of the budget issue, I am currently working on a pitch to adapt it into the Graphic Novel format.


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## Ithilethiel (Jun 11, 2018)

CirdanLinweilin said:


> _Gesundheit.
> 
> _
> CL



Heehee


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## Squint-eyed Southerner (Jun 11, 2018)

Ithilethiel said:


> Scrubbing Bubbles! The Evil Lighthouse! I love it!



Now I can't find the post where those appeared! Oh well. . .


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## MidnightStorm (Jun 21, 2018)

I honestly don’t think The Silmarillion as a movie would work out too well. It is perhaps more of a history rather then a story. If they did make a movie of it, I’d hope they stick to the proper story (probably not) and not do something like The Hobbit movies.
Beren and Luthien could work as a movie, if they portrayed the characters right; however, it would be quite hard to accurately display Luthien on screen.


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## Ithilethiel (Jun 21, 2018)

MidnightStorm said:


> I honestly don’t think The Silmarillion as a movie would work out too well. It is perhaps more of a history rather then a story. If they did make a movie of it, I’d hope they stick to the proper story (probably not) and not do something like The Hobbit movies.
> Beren and Luthien could work as a movie, if they portrayed the characters right; however, it would be quite hard to accurately display Luthien on screen.



I agree MidnightStorm. As much as we fans long to see it done right even CT had his own difficulties with compiling the book as his father had been continuously evolving and altering the work as his stories developed through the years. There are disharmonies with certain tales and inconsistencies with certain characters. The book took on a life of its own so what is easier to accept by devotees who understand these issues in the hands of a say, Peter Jackson would be a disaster.

It is possible to maintain consistency within individual lore but there still remains the issue of being true to the spirit of the tale. A much more difficult undertaking. So as SeS likes to say, I'm paraphrasing, _be careful what you wish for._


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